BB26 Why ___ Won and Others Lost

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_02]: This is why blank lost. This is why blank lost. This is why blank lost. Welcome back to why blank lost for Big Brother 26 or as we call it this time why blank won and the other three lost. I'm David Bloomberg and I'm here with my co-host Ovi Kabir for our look at the final four and especially Chelsea who deserves huge congratulations for her win.

[00:00:37] [SPEAKER_03]: Thank you David we have maybe here we have marathoned our way here from our viewers our listeners we have finally completed the season we have a winner few losers and like many of us we were on the edge of our seats like some of the house guests we were asleep for these 90 days. We will see why some of these went home but I think it's very clear to from those watching or listening at home why Chelsea won but I'm excited to break it down with you David.

[00:01:03] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean Chelsea got taken to the end by the final Hoh winner and beat her unanimously that is one heck of a feat.

[00:01:12] [SPEAKER_03]: It most definitely is I mean I think when we go back in the history of big brother there's very few players who have accomplished such a unanimous win with also I don't believe any votes against and to her pedigree with four H.O.H. which matches the most H which is one is season I mean truly an all around player.

[00:01:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, yes. Now because we did not do a separate podcast for Rubina when she was eliminated on Thursday we have four people to talk about here.

[00:01:41] [SPEAKER_02]: So yes, we will even cover Mackenzie even though she insisted her game spoke for itself.

[00:01:49] [SPEAKER_02]: But we will evaluate them all in the usual way by comparing how they played to my rules for winning big brother which I originally wrote 20 years ago in 2004 and have modified ever since.

[00:02:00] [SPEAKER_02]: We will analyze their actions using what we saw on TV live feeds interviews and other information.

[00:02:06] [SPEAKER_02]: And of course the most recent version of those rules is that Rob has website that com slash big brother rules in case you know someone out there listening or watching is planning to apply and wants to study up.

[00:02:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, with that said, one of our normal podcasts goes an hour to an hour and a half.

[00:02:26] [SPEAKER_02]: We don't want this to be four plus hours.

[00:02:28] [SPEAKER_02]: So we aren't going to be able to go into all the levels of detail we normally would.

[00:02:33] [SPEAKER_02]: We will hit the most important points.

[00:02:35] [SPEAKER_02]: We will not be giving every example.

[00:02:38] [SPEAKER_02]: I was going through my notes.

[00:02:39] [SPEAKER_02]: Don't need that.

[00:02:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Don't need that.

[00:02:41] [SPEAKER_02]: And since this was a 90 day game, some things changed over the months anyway.

[00:02:46] [SPEAKER_01]: And let's be honest.

[00:02:48] [SPEAKER_01]: For two of these four, there really isn't as much to talk about.

[00:02:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:02:56] [SPEAKER_03]: The shit has started already.

[00:02:58] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm glad we're starting early.

[00:03:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, we usually have some other things to discuss about the week in general before we get to the rules.

[00:03:08] [SPEAKER_02]: But not this time.

[00:03:09] [SPEAKER_02]: It's all about the final four and how they did in the rules.

[00:03:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, we will have a final edition of our usual segment.

[00:03:15] [SPEAKER_02]: Julie Chen Moonves is wrong about blank.

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_02]: But it'll come at the end of the rules because that's where it makes the most sense.

[00:03:23] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, I do want to say, of course, that before we get to the rules, we should mention that there is a survivor version of or rather there is a poster of the survivor version of the rules, which you can get at robhazwebsite.com slash yxlossfeed.

[00:03:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Go there.

[00:03:41] [SPEAKER_02]: Scroll down.

[00:03:42] [SPEAKER_02]: Click order.

[00:03:43] [SPEAKER_02]: You could also keep scrolling and get the poster on a T-shirt or get the checklist on a T-shirt, which is the same that I'm wearing.

[00:03:49] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just wearing it backwards in honor of the person who won.

[00:03:54] [SPEAKER_02]: So, again, you can go to robhazwebsite.com slash yxlossfeed.

[00:04:04] [SPEAKER_02]: So, if you don't have anything else, let's head into the rules.

[00:04:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Let's do it.

[00:04:10] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm all for it.

[00:04:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Chelsea did a great job of laying out the important aspects of her winning game in her final two responses and speech.

[00:04:20] [SPEAKER_02]: Mackenzie accidentally also did a great job of laying out the important aspects of why she didn't win.

[00:04:26] [SPEAKER_02]: But while both of those had the highlights, there was a lot more to the intricacies of the situation.

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, we'll also see what we can dig up for Cam and Rubina as well.

[00:04:36] [SPEAKER_02]: And, all right, JP, we know reality TV.

[00:04:39] [SPEAKER_02]: And we know why Chelsea won and Mackenzie, Cam, and Rubina lost.

[00:04:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, the first and most important rule is to scheme and plot.

[00:04:49] [SPEAKER_02]: Of the final four players, only one actually understood that.

[00:04:55] [SPEAKER_02]: And that was, of course, Chelsea.

[00:04:57] [SPEAKER_02]: And I don't think it's a coincidence that she's the biggest fan among the group.

[00:05:02] [SPEAKER_02]: As Joseph told Entertainment Weekly way back after he was voted out, Chelsea is playing the best game by far.

[00:05:09] [SPEAKER_02]: She's been the best player since day one, day two.

[00:05:12] [SPEAKER_02]: And I knew it from the get-go.

[00:05:14] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, I have to acknowledge myself that way back in our preview podcast, I did not have a good feeling about Chelsea.

[00:05:22] [SPEAKER_02]: But my opinion changed immediately upon seeing her the very first week.

[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Right off the bat, she maneuvered herself around being downgraded.

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_02]: And she had daily camera chats where she showed that she understands the game.

[00:05:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Chelsea has been behind many of the moves made this season, especially moves made by other people like, of course, Mackenzie.

[00:05:43] [SPEAKER_02]: But also was a significant force behind evicting Joseph Quinn and Leah, among others.

[00:05:50] [SPEAKER_03]: Chelsea was truly a unique player we've got to see.

[00:05:54] [SPEAKER_03]: And similar to you, and many of our viewers and listeners can probably attest to this,

[00:05:57] [SPEAKER_03]: is that initially in our preseason ranking of how we thought each player would do in comparison to these rules,

[00:06:04] [SPEAKER_03]: we weren't the highest on Chelsea.

[00:06:06] [SPEAKER_03]: If anything, we were kind of lower on Chelsea and Cedric because of his youth.

[00:06:10] [SPEAKER_03]: And we kind of attested that to Chelsea.

[00:06:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Unsure how she will play the game.

[00:06:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Sometimes being a huge fan means that the moment becomes so big for you that you get excited to play the game.

[00:06:21] [SPEAKER_03]: We forget kind of everything you know.

[00:06:22] [SPEAKER_03]: And we were kind of like proven that, oh, maybe we were right about our rankings week one when they both got downgraded and we're like, ah, they're in trouble.

[00:06:30] [SPEAKER_03]: But to our surprise, they were not even a target because they had maneuvered themselves so well.

[00:06:36] [SPEAKER_03]: And for Cedric, unfortunately, his time was cut short.

[00:06:39] [SPEAKER_03]: But for Chelsea, she continued that wave throughout the game, maneuvering herself from ally to ally to winning competitions.

[00:06:46] [SPEAKER_03]: But more than anything, her ability of mist.

[00:06:49] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, the way she was able to use her mist and confuse her closest allies or convince them that they should sabotage their game or her game.

[00:06:58] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I don't know how you can be a fan of Big Brother and love strategy and gameplay and not recognize the kind of game Chelsea played.

[00:07:07] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, this was great to watch.

[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. And she told us what type of game she was going to play early on, way back in early August.

[00:07:16] [SPEAKER_02]: It was a key moment that gave us and by us, I mean, mostly live feed viewers insight into how she was thinking.

[00:07:23] [SPEAKER_02]: And I say live feed viewers because it wasn't on TV.

[00:07:28] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, if you follow me on my various video locations, then, you know, you saw this as a video because I put it up.

[00:07:35] [SPEAKER_02]: But beyond that, you know, the house guests were about to play a game of Mafia to pass the time.

[00:07:41] [SPEAKER_02]: They did this fairly frequently early on.

[00:07:45] [SPEAKER_02]: And it was funny because a lot of the live feed viewers were like, stop playing that game and start playing the game of Big Brother.

[00:07:52] [SPEAKER_02]: But Chelsea used it as a way to kind of compare the two because she was giving a camera chat with Brooklyn in the background, nodding along with her.

[00:08:03] [SPEAKER_02]: As they they were getting ready to go play Mafia and Chelsea noted that lying is part of the game of Mafia.

[00:08:10] [SPEAKER_02]: And you don't go into it saying I'm going to be as pure as possible.

[00:08:14] [SPEAKER_02]: She said, this is not church.

[00:08:17] [SPEAKER_02]: This is the game.

[00:08:18] [SPEAKER_02]: If you're playing the game, that's part of the game.

[00:08:20] [SPEAKER_02]: So don't come into Big Brother and say you want to keep your morals intact.

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_02]: A quote.

[00:08:25] [SPEAKER_02]: This ain't Duno.

[00:08:26] [SPEAKER_02]: This ain't Monopoly.

[00:08:27] [SPEAKER_02]: This ain't Twister.

[00:08:28] [SPEAKER_02]: This is Big Brother.

[00:08:29] [SPEAKER_02]: Play the game.

[00:08:31] [SPEAKER_02]: And obviously we can see how Chelsea did that all the way until the end.

[00:08:36] [SPEAKER_02]: While McKenzie, she did exactly what Chelsea said not to do by, you know, keeping her loyalty and morals.

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, I will test that.

[00:08:46] [SPEAKER_03]: I was a bit higher on McKenzie's game throughout the entirety of it because I saw her, the way she was playing, kind of giving some bad hands in the beginning where her allies went home.

[00:08:57] [SPEAKER_03]: She doesn't understand the game and kind of gets her footing for her competition wins and finds herself parts of different alliances.

[00:09:03] [SPEAKER_03]: The issue was, is that we didn't see the moves he wanted to see her make for her own game.

[00:09:10] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that really differentiates her journey from Chelsea's, from the intentional moves you make from strategy, from winning competitions versus McKenzie's was kind of raw skill that she did to win things and put herself in places.

[00:09:24] [SPEAKER_03]: There was not much intentionality in it.

[00:09:26] [SPEAKER_03]: And we see that really come ahead at the end where to win this game, the end game is a different beast, you know, than the rest of the season.

[00:09:36] [SPEAKER_03]: So if you don't plan out each place or if you don't make that right move at the end, it doesn't matter how much you lead up to it.

[00:09:43] [SPEAKER_03]: You can take any journey to get there.

[00:09:45] [SPEAKER_03]: We agree that there are certain rules that help you have a better chance to get there.

[00:09:49] [SPEAKER_03]: But the final move you have to make is to ensure your own ability to win it.

[00:09:55] [SPEAKER_03]: And we saw who did that best.

[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_02]: And so you mentioned intentionality.

[00:09:59] [SPEAKER_02]: And that is something that we saw out of Chelsea because other, well, I say we saw, we the viewers saw it.

[00:10:07] [SPEAKER_02]: The other players did not because other than the camera talk with Brooklyn there, Chelsea pretty much kept her strategic side to the diary rooms and private camera chats.

[00:10:17] [SPEAKER_02]: She told Mike Bloom, none of the house guests I think knew how strategic I was behind the scenes, how hardcore, how direct I was in my decision making.

[00:10:26] [SPEAKER_02]: I think they thought I was just living my best life in the Big Brother house.

[00:10:30] [SPEAKER_02]: There was not a moment that went by in Big Brother that I was not thinking or strategizing.

[00:10:34] [SPEAKER_02]: But I kept that to myself.

[00:10:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Every move I made in this game, every decision, every conversation was calculated.

[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_02]: And that, I think, got me this far.

[00:10:43] [SPEAKER_02]: And I agree with her.

[00:10:44] [SPEAKER_02]: I think that got her this far, too.

[00:10:47] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, she looking back in the game, she had several different alliances, named and unnamed.

[00:10:55] [SPEAKER_02]: She and Cam agreed to look out for each other early on.

[00:10:58] [SPEAKER_02]: And that obviously continued all the way through, though.

[00:11:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Part of that at the end, I think, was she saw how easy he would be to beat.

[00:11:05] [SPEAKER_02]: But she and T-Corps were also looking out for each other.

[00:11:08] [SPEAKER_02]: And she even tried to save T-Corps when the time came, but was smart enough not to push so hard that it endangered her own game.

[00:11:17] [SPEAKER_02]: When she saw it wasn't going to go that way.

[00:11:19] [SPEAKER_02]: She was in the Pentagon and the collective.

[00:11:21] [SPEAKER_02]: And when it all fell apart, she laid low for a couple weeks before beginning her rebuild.

[00:11:28] [SPEAKER_02]: Which does lead to an important point that we should know.

[00:11:32] [SPEAKER_02]: She did a great job.

[00:11:33] [SPEAKER_02]: She wasn't perfect.

[00:11:35] [SPEAKER_02]: Nobody is.

[00:11:36] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, maybe me.

[00:11:37] [SPEAKER_02]: But other than that, you know, in the game.

[00:11:41] [SPEAKER_02]: She and Brooklyn got too comfortable and passive for a little while.

[00:11:45] [SPEAKER_02]: Which led to the flip against Cedric and the blowing up of those alliances.

[00:11:49] [SPEAKER_02]: And indeed, we discussed on the Why Brooklyn Lost and Why Cedric Lost podcasts that Brooklyn and Chelsea were kind of on cruise control at the time.

[00:11:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Letting relationships with McKenzie and Leah lapse.

[00:12:01] [SPEAKER_02]: So their numbers were left hanging in the wind.

[00:12:03] [SPEAKER_02]: But two things happened at that point.

[00:12:06] [SPEAKER_02]: First, while Brooklyn sulked and whined and complained about what happened, Chelsea went to work.

[00:12:14] [SPEAKER_02]: She immediately started talking to people and shoring up relationships and locking in votes.

[00:12:18] [SPEAKER_02]: To the point that by the end of that week, people would have been willing to flip to save Chelsea if Brooklyn had won the AI arena.

[00:12:27] [SPEAKER_02]: But they weren't going to do it for Brooklyn when Chelsea won.

[00:12:31] [SPEAKER_02]: And then second, Chelsea learned from those mistakes and also made moves to start locking in McKenzie for the future, which obviously paid huge dividends.

[00:12:43] [SPEAKER_02]: Literally.

[00:12:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, no, you make a great point there, Dave.

[00:12:48] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think one thing I realized watching and just being a fan of both shows from Survivor and Big Brother, that's kind of the difference with Big Brother is that when you make a mistake or something happens like this, there's enough time to steer the ship back.

[00:13:01] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's when we talk about how our players are flexible, how they do this.

[00:13:04] [SPEAKER_03]: And Chelsea, she steered that ship right back to it.

[00:13:07] [SPEAKER_03]: And like you said, she went to work.

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I think one of the greatest moves she made in this game that wasn't really talked about for now was her connection to T-Corps.

[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, figuring out who was the head of that flip, connecting with them and ensuring that, hey, we have a bond.

[00:13:22] [SPEAKER_03]: We want to go forward together.

[00:13:23] [SPEAKER_03]: And because of that, that short her up with Kimo, that short her up with Rabina.

[00:13:27] [SPEAKER_03]: And it helped her from a flip that should have basically put her game back into a hole she was able to come out of.

[00:13:34] [SPEAKER_03]: It's very impressive to see, okay, I went wrong.

[00:13:37] [SPEAKER_03]: This is what happened.

[00:13:38] [SPEAKER_03]: Now, what do I do to change the trajectory of my, you know, my, my game going right now?

[00:13:43] [SPEAKER_03]: And the difference is, is we didn't see that out of McKenzie.

[00:13:46] [SPEAKER_03]: We didn't really see that.

[00:13:48] [SPEAKER_03]: And just to loop them in there with Kamara being a very much where it was like, hey, we need to not play differently.

[00:13:54] [SPEAKER_03]: We didn't see that from each of these players.

[00:13:56] [SPEAKER_03]: And to McKenzie's credit, it's impressive.

[00:13:59] [SPEAKER_03]: It worked as long as it did for her, I believe, because she was able to brute force her way through the game in so many measures and still have connections with people and not really rub people the wrong way.

[00:14:11] [SPEAKER_03]: McKenzie probably was, could have played one of the cleanest games from her view and some other viewers viewpoints if she just made that right move at the end.

[00:14:21] [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, it was laid out for her.

[00:14:23] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's why I think it's most frustrating to see what happened.

[00:14:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:14:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:14:27] [SPEAKER_02]: And I'll have plenty of thoughts on McKenzie's move or lack thereof, but, but, you know, even going back to early on and I, let me just get this out of the way now, because you said, you know, McKenzie pushed her way through the game and other people have said, well, she made it to final two.

[00:14:45] [SPEAKER_02]: By my view, McKenzie did not make it through the game.

[00:14:49] [SPEAKER_02]: Chelsea puppeted McKenzie through the game.

[00:14:52] [SPEAKER_02]: If Chelsea had not wanted McKenzie there, I do not think McKenzie would have been there.

[00:14:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Sure.

[00:14:58] [SPEAKER_02]: She won, you know, comps and saved herself, but not every comp, you know, there were times Chelsea could have gotten rid of her if she wanted to, but it was much more advantageous to keep her there.

[00:15:11] [SPEAKER_02]: And, and that's, you know, even way back at the beginning of the game, Chelsea, uh, you know, kind of treated McKenzie like clay that she could mold.

[00:15:21] [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and even in McKenzie's final two answers, she talked about getting herself out of trouble earlier, but it was Chelsea's advice at that point that guided her even back then telling her how to do things like.

[00:15:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Talk to people, you know, explaining to her way back in early August, how you need numbers in big brother.

[00:15:44] [SPEAKER_02]: And it's a long game and playing safe in the beginning is playing smart.

[00:15:48] [SPEAKER_02]: And then after that break that I mentioned where she kind of let McKenzie and Leah drift when she pulled her back in, uh, well, you know, she told Chelsea told Dalton Ross, I controlled her game for the second half of this game.

[00:16:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Even when she won, she did everything that I led her to do.

[00:16:05] [SPEAKER_02]: And the jury knew that.

[00:16:09] [SPEAKER_02]: And McKenzie obviously was the most important person Chelsea controlled, but it wasn't the only one.

[00:16:16] [SPEAKER_02]: She didn't just have one puppet.

[00:16:18] [SPEAKER_02]: There were other examples throughout the season.

[00:16:22] [SPEAKER_02]: Another, uh, good one was when Chelsea took out Leah's allies twice in a row, but then Leah decided to trust her.

[00:16:31] [SPEAKER_02]: After Chelsea had like basically one conversation with her.

[00:16:36] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I, as you know, Leah came into Chelsea, like I'm mad at you and walked away apologizing after Chelsea took out two of her allies.

[00:16:46] [SPEAKER_02]: I, you know, we heard in the finale and also on live feeds earlier, Chelsea was a great speaker and used the power of her words.

[00:16:55] [SPEAKER_02]: And I talked on a previous podcast about her planting those seeds and watering them slowly and letting her ideas grow in someone else's mind to the point that they did not even realize it was happening.

[00:17:07] [SPEAKER_03]: She had the gift of gab, you know, it really, the way she could have conversations.

[00:17:11] [SPEAKER_03]: And what I also enjoyed watching Chelsea play in a lot of ways, it was that even the players who would go home or they were just coming out the door, she would make them feel, you know, special in different ways from how she, you know, we'll talk more about that.

[00:17:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Her jury management with her relationship with Quinn in ways in how, when he was, she knew he was going home.

[00:17:31] [SPEAKER_03]: He knew he was going home, essentially the way she made time spent, try to set him up with Leah, you know, and that's what I appreciated out of her game from all forms of it.

[00:17:41] [SPEAKER_03]: There was a, there was a drive to win, you know, she wanted to win so badly that she was able to ensure that all the things moves she made would benefit her in the game, but also just enjoy, like live in the house that way, you know?

[00:17:56] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think watching her was a pleasure because you could see her work 24 seven and figure out how can I win this game?

[00:18:03] [SPEAKER_03]: And I mean, as viewers and as, you know, people who commentate on this season on and show on people's strategy, like what more can we ask for?

[00:18:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[00:18:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Who she went against you.

[00:18:14] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it wasn't, I mean, I know you, you, I put a little nicer that they manipulate the puppeteer McKenzie, but she had to figure out a, like a line walk here because McKenzie in all terms could have turned on her at any moment.

[00:18:31] [SPEAKER_03]: If she really did want to, she was able to win these competitions.

[00:18:34] [SPEAKER_03]: So it's kind of like playing with fire.

[00:18:36] [SPEAKER_03]: How close can you get to the fire without it burning?

[00:18:39] [SPEAKER_03]: And so that was a cool thing.

[00:18:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think on a rewatch, it's going to be even more fun to watch that portion of how does Chelsea manage these players around her who really could burn her up in any moment.

[00:18:50] [SPEAKER_03]: She backstabbed Cam, who he should have been like, Hey, let me burn her up.

[00:18:54] [SPEAKER_03]: All these players, Leah, you put a perfect example, how she takes out her allies, but figures out a way how to manage it.

[00:18:59] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, that's impressive to be in the kitchen like that and not get boiled by the water.

[00:19:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:19:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:19:06] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, she, you, you say it'll be fun on a rewatch.

[00:19:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Unfortunately, a lot of this was hidden on, on TV itself, you know, only on the live feeds, which of course they're not allowing anyone to save.

[00:19:20] [SPEAKER_02]: Although I, I know there are places out there that have them, but it's, yeah, it is interesting how she managed to do that.

[00:19:29] [SPEAKER_02]: But you say it's playing with fire.

[00:19:32] [SPEAKER_02]: I say she played with fire, but she also had an asbestos suit on, you know, because she knew that the fire wasn't going to come back at her.

[00:19:42] [SPEAKER_02]: She knew which way the wind was blowing because she was blowing the wind.

[00:19:46] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, she was, she was causing it to blow in other directions.

[00:19:53] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, I hope she gets to see that portion.

[00:19:55] [SPEAKER_03]: If anything, she gets a clip she sees is that what I think that that really does capsulate her game.

[00:20:01] [SPEAKER_03]: She was to win.

[00:20:02] [SPEAKER_03]: She blew the direction.

[00:20:03] [SPEAKER_03]: She, yes, you know, in a lot of ways, but I will say though, there has to be a level of courage and to be playing with that trio for so long.

[00:20:15] [SPEAKER_03]: She did with Rabina T-Corps and a chemo and not worrying that they'll turn on you, you know, and having other people around you take them out.

[00:20:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[00:20:24] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I think that portion was impressive with me.

[00:20:26] [SPEAKER_03]: The whole, and I wonder if the pendulum swung a little bit more for Chelsea when she realized Mackenzie would take out Leah and knew that she's in her pocket, you know, at that point, taking out your closest ally for me.

[00:20:38] [SPEAKER_03]: I think so many times, and I've said this many times before, it's tough when you're in the big brother house because sometimes it's a rotten apple and you're a worm in the apple.

[00:20:46] [SPEAKER_03]: So you can't see how the outside looks like from the inside there.

[00:20:50] [SPEAKER_03]: And so these players truly could not see how Chelsea was basically, she wasn't a worm in the apple.

[00:20:56] [SPEAKER_03]: She was the apple.

[00:20:57] [SPEAKER_03]: She was able to do whatever she wanted there.

[00:21:00] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, she even did things like incorporating events that occurred and using them to push a plan she already had in mind.

[00:21:12] [SPEAKER_02]: So like if she wanted to move a certain way and then something happened, she would use that to her advantage.

[00:21:22] [SPEAKER_02]: So a good example is Angela came to her with that delusionary story that one night that Angela was up and heard Quinn and Leah laughing and determined it must be this whole complex thing that Quinn and Leah were joining forces with T-Corps, Kimo, and Rubina.

[00:21:40] [SPEAKER_02]: It didn't matter to Chelsea that the whole thing was false.

[00:21:44] [SPEAKER_02]: She knew it was false.

[00:21:46] [SPEAKER_02]: What mattered was that she could use it to get other people thinking the way she wanted them to think about Quinn and could target him.

[00:21:57] [SPEAKER_02]: And then the same thing happened when she wanted McKenzie to nominate and evict Leah, but McKenzie was holding out, you know, and then Rubina told her about Leah mentioning, oh, she wished she'd made a big move the prior week and even said Chelsea's name.

[00:22:11] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, Chelsea used that to show McKenzie that she was supposedly in danger and Leah wasn't trustworthy.

[00:22:18] [SPEAKER_02]: As she told Mike Bloom, she would lay things out, quote, to get people to look at the other side of the coin and make other people be threats.

[00:22:27] [SPEAKER_02]: I just didn't reveal that I was a bigger threat than everybody.

[00:22:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, she stood in the middle of the shooting ground.

[00:22:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I was able to dodge all these bullets and make sure they would shoot themselves.

[00:22:38] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I go back and forth in thinking about how she, you know, she managed the Angela situation and basically making Angela vote for her who seemed so bitter, you know, against her and then got her vote.

[00:22:54] [SPEAKER_03]: I think people realize is that she wasn't the one really pulling the trigger on many things.

[00:22:59] [SPEAKER_03]: She was just maneuvering people to do that to themselves.

[00:23:01] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's just an impressive ability there.

[00:23:04] [SPEAKER_03]: I will say, I think it's interesting as we talk about all our players as our winners, some of our losers today too, with the regarding Cam.

[00:23:13] [SPEAKER_03]: I think it was impressive how Cam was very close.

[00:23:17] [SPEAKER_03]: We saw it to McKenzie at some point, to Leah at some point.

[00:23:21] [SPEAKER_03]: And then even though there was a little rift between Cam and Chelsea, she was able to keep him in her group of people, not just in her group of people, her small circle of him and her, where at the end he self-professes.

[00:23:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I would take her.

[00:23:36] [SPEAKER_03]: She became one of the dogs at the crib because he was shouting her out at the end.

[00:23:39] [SPEAKER_03]: He was willing to, one, just vote her through there, but make her a winner.

[00:23:43] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, he was basically the best ally you could hope for in a game where you can do whatever you would want to him and are still going to vote for you to win.

[00:23:52] [SPEAKER_03]: And also vote with you each week and out.

[00:23:54] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, she was a power duo with him without it being seen like.

[00:23:59] [SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[00:24:00] [SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[00:24:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:24:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, since you mentioned moving on to other players, I think we can move to McKenzie.

[00:24:06] [SPEAKER_02]: You may disagree, but I don't think I'm being overly mean or harsh.

[00:24:10] [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, when I say simply that McKenzie had no idea how to play this game from a strategic standpoint.

[00:24:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Um, I mean, she came in barely having watched it.

[00:24:22] [SPEAKER_02]: She admitted she didn't even really make it through the whole season, you know, in watching it.

[00:24:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, she, she admitted and then showed that she was gullible and naive.

[00:24:33] [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and I could go on, but I won't, I, I, you know, no need to completely keep.

[00:24:38] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, yeah, I've still got a lot more to say.

[00:24:41] [SPEAKER_02]: Now this was all a main reason she had a rough time early.

[00:24:45] [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, she was wandering without a home until Chelsea snagged her and reeled her in.

[00:24:51] [SPEAKER_02]: And then Chelsea spill, uh, filled the empty spot in her head where strategy should have been with whatever thoughts Chelsea wanted to have.

[00:25:00] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, she, we talked about her planting seeds.

[00:25:02] [SPEAKER_02]: She planted a whole dang garden in McKenzie's head.

[00:25:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Um, not the garden.

[00:25:08] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:25:09] [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, it was like a chia pet in there.

[00:25:11] [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and you know, while McKenzie insisted in response to a jury question that nobody can influence me.

[00:25:19] [SPEAKER_02]: I made decisions for myself.

[00:25:21] [SPEAKER_02]: The facts tell a very different story all the way up to, and including McKenzie telling Mike Bloom after giving away $675,000.

[00:25:32] [SPEAKER_02]: That for her Chelsea winning was herself winning.

[00:25:36] [SPEAKER_02]: No, McKenzie, it was not Chelsea winning was you losing.

[00:25:41] [SPEAKER_03]: We should be sitting here talking about why McKenzie won today in almost every universe, because this is probably one of the most egregious, uh, final two pulls.

[00:25:52] [SPEAKER_03]: I know there's arguments about all different seasons.

[00:25:55] [SPEAKER_03]: BB 20 goes back.

[00:25:57] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, people taking somebody to the end who beats them.

[00:26:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Um, this one is the one we're going to look back and be like, why, why did you do such a thing?

[00:26:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, we're explaining why.

[00:26:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:26:07] [SPEAKER_03]: We're explaining why, but it, we, I have to believe that she resigned herself to win number two, no matter what, because, uh, there was no fathomable way she could go.

[00:26:21] [SPEAKER_03]: And here's the thing is if you were going, um, uh, pound for pound, let's say go for a win for win, uh, HOH, HOH.

[00:26:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Chelsea was no slouch against the wins.

[00:26:30] [SPEAKER_03]: If anything, she tied the record.

[00:26:32] [SPEAKER_03]: So it's one of those things where you don't want to have a, uh, perceivable, uh, advantage in any of the categories where it's like, I crushed you here.

[00:26:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Even if you crushed me here, it wasn't that thing.

[00:26:42] [SPEAKER_03]: She was so well-rounded.

[00:26:43] [SPEAKER_03]: So, uh, for McKenzie, it was really tough because, uh, you know, I was a little nicer and I'm, I will be nicer to McKenzie in this position.

[00:26:50] [SPEAKER_03]: She was one of our people recruited, I believe on the show, didn't really know what was going on.

[00:26:54] [SPEAKER_03]: Um, and she was trying to figure it out as it went through it.

[00:26:58] [SPEAKER_03]: We saw from our first week of romance going away from all her allies getting blown up and she found her footing.

[00:27:04] [SPEAKER_03]: The issue was, was that every move she made, like you said, I think she thought they had her best interests in mind.

[00:27:10] [SPEAKER_03]: I think she forgot that they're trying to win too.

[00:27:12] [SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, I was looking at an honor strategy.

[00:27:14] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:27:15] [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that, you know, that's, that's a, an important point that, you know, she, like I said, she, I don't think she watched a full season.

[00:27:23] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, she, she did not know what was important.

[00:27:26] [SPEAKER_02]: She did not know how to play this game.

[00:27:29] [SPEAKER_02]: And I, I, I'm sorry if anyone thinks that sounds mean, it is just a simple fact.

[00:27:34] [SPEAKER_02]: She did not know.

[00:27:35] [SPEAKER_02]: And who was she getting most of her advice from Chelsea, you know, and we'll see that as we go

[00:27:40] [SPEAKER_02]: through and we talk about some of the end game stuff later on too, because Chelsea was the

[00:27:46] [SPEAKER_02]: one telling her how to play.

[00:27:48] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, when you're getting advice from your competitor, you know, like maybe you should

[00:27:54] [SPEAKER_02]: be thinking about that.

[00:27:55] [SPEAKER_02]: Like if the quarterback tells the opposing, uh, you know, the, the opposing cornerback, I'm

[00:28:03] [SPEAKER_02]: going to be throwing it directly to the guy you're guarding.

[00:28:06] [SPEAKER_02]: So you can intercept it.

[00:28:08] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, maybe you should think, huh, is he really going to do that?

[00:28:13] [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, you know, if the, if the pitcher tells you I'm going to be throwing a fastball right down the center.

[00:28:20] [SPEAKER_02]: So you should just swing right there.

[00:28:23] [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe you should wonder if that's really true.

[00:28:26] [SPEAKER_02]: And yet that is what Chelsea was doing.

[00:28:28] [SPEAKER_02]: Now the difference is it wasn't just two teams for most of the way, most of the time they, you know, McKenzie felt they were working together.

[00:28:37] [SPEAKER_02]: They were working together the same way a puppeteer and a puppet work together.

[00:28:41] [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, but you know, so it seemed like Chelsea had McKenzie's best interests at heart, but it was really Chelsea's best interests at heart.

[00:28:52] [SPEAKER_02]: It just happened to coincide with, and McKenzie will do these things and we'll think that, you know, I'm on her side.

[00:28:59] [SPEAKER_02]: So it was kind of like, I guess the best example I could be is if you two, you know, you're on a team.

[00:29:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, maybe it's, maybe it's like boxers or MMA fighters who train together in the same gym, you know, and they train together and they train together.

[00:29:15] [SPEAKER_02]: And then suddenly they're in opposition.

[00:29:20] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, now, you know, you know, you know, their moves if they've been truly helping you, but maybe you held a few things back.

[00:29:28] [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe you didn't tell them certain things.

[00:29:31] [SPEAKER_03]: No, very much.

[00:29:32] [SPEAKER_03]: So, I mean, I love all the analogies right there, because it is very much likened to that when you, and I think a lot of people who might just stumble onto the show.

[00:29:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't imagine it's any more viewers or listeners if they're actually here, but they feel like Big Brother is just kind of a social game in a sense of that.

[00:29:47] [SPEAKER_03]: So, you know, there's not, you just have to be there, be nice or figure out a way to cut throws.

[00:29:52] [SPEAKER_03]: There's such a level of strategy to it each week, figuring out, going through the scenarios in your head.

[00:29:57] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's like playing a game of chess, but you don't know how to play the end game of chess.

[00:30:01] [SPEAKER_03]: And if you don't know how to do that, you're really lost when you play against somebody who knows how to play.

[00:30:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Because there's so many different forms of strategy to kind of make somebody who might be incredibly intelligent, smart at it, but they don't know the rules.

[00:30:12] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that was the issue for Mackenzie.

[00:30:14] [SPEAKER_03]: She didn't know how to maneuver herself through that.

[00:30:16] [SPEAKER_03]: And her other closest allies weren't really helping very much.

[00:30:20] [SPEAKER_03]: We had Leah and we had Angela right here.

[00:30:23] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm not counting Matt, because Matt was out early.

[00:30:25] [SPEAKER_03]: But Leah and Angela basically were shooting themselves off the foot too, every single moment they could get.

[00:30:29] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, Angela, we saw the type of player she was.

[00:30:32] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, was she entertaining?

[00:30:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Very much so.

[00:30:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Was she a wrecking ball that would devour anybody around her?

[00:30:38] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, she was.

[00:30:39] [SPEAKER_03]: And Leah, I mean, I could go all day on Leah.

[00:30:44] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we saw what she did to her own ally.

[00:30:47] [SPEAKER_03]: So Chelsea was basically the shining morning star.

[00:30:50] [SPEAKER_03]: I think that's what made it difficult for Mackenzie too, that if it was a one side versus the other side, maybe she could start seeing like, all right, I know I need to cut her eventually.

[00:30:59] [SPEAKER_03]: But when you have this small group of people where you're taking down each side, you know, eventually you're like, I got to trust my bestie.

[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's what she did.

[00:31:07] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:31:08] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:31:08] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, we've been talking about Mackenzie's, you know, well, you know, not knowing what's going on.

[00:31:14] [SPEAKER_02]: And I have a few examples of her strategic aimlessness early.

[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_02]: In the very first week, Mackenzie was talking about going after Angela while Angela was the HOH and before she had even made nominations.

[00:31:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, anyone who's watched Big Brother and paid any attention knows you don't do that.

[00:31:33] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, she escaped from that.

[00:31:36] [SPEAKER_02]: In the early to mid game, we would see her doing things like lobbying the wrong people, such as talking to the HOH after final nominations had been set and it wasn't up to the HOH anymore.

[00:31:46] [SPEAKER_02]: No, that's not the person you need to convince now.

[00:31:49] [SPEAKER_02]: It's the voters.

[00:31:51] [SPEAKER_02]: Back in early to mid August, she said, I don't know where I lie in this house.

[00:31:57] [SPEAKER_02]: That should have told her the answer of where she lies in the house, but it didn't.

[00:32:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Then around that same time, she was on the block, realized, huh, I haven't talked game with anyone all day.

[00:32:10] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's a problem.

[00:32:11] [SPEAKER_02]: By that evening, Leah was coaching her on how to campaign.

[00:32:16] [SPEAKER_02]: Even when she did try to campaign, she would say unhelpful things like I didn't do anything wrong or I never lied to anyone.

[00:32:24] [SPEAKER_02]: As if this was a contest of morality, which she never seemed to learn it wasn't.

[00:32:30] [SPEAKER_02]: And then a little later, she told T-Corps she didn't really know who to work with because no one talked game with her.

[00:32:37] [SPEAKER_02]: And indeed, I think she may have spent more time telling others she couldn't get into any alliances than she actually did trying to get into alliances.

[00:32:44] [SPEAKER_02]: She just did not know how to go about it.

[00:32:48] [SPEAKER_02]: But as Brooklyn told Dalton Ross in her exit interview, Mackenzie was, quote, confused and not in anything.

[00:32:56] [SPEAKER_02]: And as Mackenzie herself said around that same time, there's a lot I'm not aware of.

[00:33:01] [SPEAKER_02]: You don't say.

[00:33:03] [SPEAKER_02]: And then, of course, she also said, I read people real well.

[00:33:09] [SPEAKER_02]: In literally the same conversation as she was reading people completely wrong, which, you know, was kind of a theme through the season.

[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_02]: But it was just one more thing of, you know, Mackenzie thinking she was in one position, but not understanding how it goes.

[00:33:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think the way I've been thinking about this since it's happened and whatnot, this finale, which has been many days, but ruminating over it.

[00:33:33] [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like for Mackenzie, maybe she was feeling like she was playing with house money in a sense that she came into the game not sure, like, how is this going to work?

[00:33:43] [SPEAKER_03]: How is it going to happen?

[00:33:44] [SPEAKER_03]: I should go out this week or that week.

[00:33:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And she made it this far.

[00:33:47] [SPEAKER_03]: She was just happy to finally get to this point, her winning these competitions.

[00:33:51] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's, I think, also what we see for a lot of people who are either recruited or, you know, who just stumble on the show where they're like, these competition wins mean I must be doing really good in the game.

[00:34:01] [SPEAKER_03]: They should show people that I deserve to win.

[00:34:04] [SPEAKER_02]: And to be fair, you know, look at Jag last season.

[00:34:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:34:08] [SPEAKER_03]: You know.

[00:34:10] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:34:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Jeff, I will say Jag had some other maneuvers there, too.

[00:34:14] [SPEAKER_03]: I know.

[00:34:15] [SPEAKER_02]: But we talked about that almost exactly a year ago, you know, or roughly a year ago.

[00:34:21] [SPEAKER_02]: But I do think that the casual viewer could watch it and go, oh, Jag won a bunch of cops and he won the game.

[00:34:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Look at that.

[00:34:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:34:28] [SPEAKER_03]: No, I think that's very good.

[00:34:30] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think for Mackenzie, she probably felt that way.

[00:34:33] [SPEAKER_03]: But she probably couldn't view all the moves Chelsea was doing in the game.

[00:34:38] [SPEAKER_03]: She hasn't watched how other juries probably have deliberated to win these things.

[00:34:41] [SPEAKER_03]: She hasn't seen those things.

[00:34:42] [SPEAKER_03]: So when you know, as a super fan and we saw him within the jury from T-Core, we saw from I think it was Quinn.

[00:34:50] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm trying to remember who else might have mentioned it.

[00:34:51] [SPEAKER_03]: But they talked about like we want to see more than just competition wins because that's kind of as viewers and longtime fans were conditioned, especially with Big Brother.

[00:34:59] [SPEAKER_03]: We're like, this is a holistic game from every A to Z.

[00:35:02] [SPEAKER_03]: We don't want to see you just excel in one portion of it.

[00:35:04] [SPEAKER_03]: So it's one of those things I wonder if that'll be easier for her to digest how she's feeling about it.

[00:35:11] [SPEAKER_03]: But I also I mean, I always ask this question.

[00:35:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Do you feel like, David, if Mackenzie came back, would she have a much better chance to be able to win knowing what she does know if she doesn't have a big target on her back?

[00:35:23] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, on the one hand, you know, one prime example we can look at is Cody.

[00:35:28] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, he made a very similar stupid move at the end and, you know, claimed it was due to loyalty.

[00:35:35] [SPEAKER_02]: And then he came back and controlled the game.

[00:35:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, he got coached up before coming back and controlling the game.

[00:35:41] [SPEAKER_02]: And but I don't know.

[00:35:47] [SPEAKER_02]: She would have she would need.

[00:35:50] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, she's only 22.

[00:35:52] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, she would need to get past some of that admitted naivete and gullibility.

[00:35:57] [SPEAKER_02]: She would need to look back and recognize what she did wrong.

[00:36:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Look back and see this is really a game.

[00:36:06] [SPEAKER_02]: I think it's too soon to say whether that she whether she would be able to do that in, say, five years time.

[00:36:15] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:36:16] [SPEAKER_02]: You know.

[00:36:19] [SPEAKER_02]: I.

[00:36:20] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't have high hopes.

[00:36:22] [SPEAKER_02]: A lot of it depends on whether she can admit to herself what she did wrong.

[00:36:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Cody still maintains he did the right thing when he did it.

[00:36:31] [SPEAKER_02]: It's easier to say once you've also won after doing it.

[00:36:34] [SPEAKER_02]: But he maintained it all the way up to going into that All-Stars.

[00:36:37] [SPEAKER_02]: So I.

[00:36:42] [SPEAKER_02]: That's a tough one.

[00:36:43] [SPEAKER_02]: I do not have high hopes.

[00:36:47] [SPEAKER_02]: But we would have to see.

[00:36:50] [SPEAKER_02]: Now.

[00:36:52] [SPEAKER_02]: As far as, you know, getting back to this season, we already discussed how Chelsea manipulated McKenzie.

[00:36:58] [SPEAKER_02]: So I don't want to completely rehash it.

[00:37:01] [SPEAKER_02]: It's just one of those facts.

[00:37:03] [SPEAKER_02]: But for example, one reason McKenzie didn't want to flip against Leah was she was afraid of losing her jury vote.

[00:37:13] [SPEAKER_02]: Which, by the way, she outright told other people, again, showing her lack of understanding of the game.

[00:37:21] [SPEAKER_02]: Like, you don't tell people, I don't want to do this because I'm afraid of losing her jury vote.

[00:37:25] [SPEAKER_02]: You have now handed over all of the information to them.

[00:37:29] [SPEAKER_02]: But anyway.

[00:37:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Chelsea used that information to convince her.

[00:37:35] [SPEAKER_02]: She would gain more votes at the end by making the move because jurors would respect it.

[00:37:41] [SPEAKER_02]: But by the time McKenzie flipped, that had become so ingrained in her mind that I don't know if she even realized that Chelsea had planted it there.

[00:37:52] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, she even said, I think about everything.

[00:37:55] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not a seasoned veteran of this game, but I'm a smart effing cookie.

[00:37:58] [SPEAKER_02]: And that's one reason it's so hard to answer your question, because it will require some actual deep self-reflection on her part.

[00:38:08] [SPEAKER_02]: And it wasn't just that Chelsea would plant idea after idea.

[00:38:12] [SPEAKER_02]: She had like a complete grip on her brain to the point that when Rubina told McKenzie that Chelsea suggested taking a shot at her in the double eviction.

[00:38:24] [SPEAKER_02]: If that were anyone else, she'd be like, oh, that's a problem.

[00:38:27] [SPEAKER_02]: No.

[00:38:28] [SPEAKER_02]: McKenzie goes back to Chelsea and says, is that true?

[00:38:32] [SPEAKER_02]: What did she expect Chelsea to say?

[00:38:34] [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yes, I was plotting against you.

[00:38:35] [SPEAKER_02]: No.

[00:38:37] [SPEAKER_02]: She said no.

[00:38:38] [SPEAKER_02]: And McKenzie believed her because the grip on her brain.

[00:38:41] [SPEAKER_02]: And this was not even the only time that the situation played out.

[00:38:47] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, McKenzie would sway in the breeze and went with whoever convinced her, which in the early game was sometimes whoever talked to her last, but became Chelsea 100% of the time almost once Chelsea locked her in.

[00:39:04] [SPEAKER_02]: And, and I have to add, maybe the funniest thing McKenzie did the whole game was at one point she gave Angela a speech about how she had to play her own game.

[00:39:14] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:39:15] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, there's going to be a lot of things in retrospect that it's going to come back to the players to look back and be like, ooh, did I really say that or need to say that?

[00:39:23] [SPEAKER_03]: I think you make a lot of good points there, Dave.

[00:39:25] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think it's important to also note at her age at 22, you know, I always forget how young she actually is.

[00:39:31] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, how old were you when you played?

[00:39:34] [SPEAKER_03]: I was, I was 22 as well.

[00:39:36] [SPEAKER_03]: So, yeah.

[00:39:36] [SPEAKER_02]: So it can't, it's, it's not all ascribed to age, you know, there is age plus super fandom, you know?

[00:39:44] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you knew what was going on.

[00:39:46] [SPEAKER_02]: You face a situation that she did not have to face.

[00:39:50] [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and, uh, you know, but if you had gotten, you know, if you hadn't had a Jackson in the house, um, if you hadn't faced that situation, when you were playing, you would have known what was going on.

[00:40:07] [SPEAKER_03]: I hope to think, but you know, there's a lot of naivety in there too.

[00:40:10] [SPEAKER_03]: And I mean, there is a lot of mistakes you make in it, but at the end of the day, right, we have to compare you for your season and what goes on.

[00:40:17] [SPEAKER_03]: And for, for Mackenzie right here, who she was going against, it's the levels were so different here compared to her and Chelsea there.

[00:40:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Um, I don't know if that's as much an excuse that happens to some of our other players that we, who lost, you know, because for Mackenzie's credit, she still fought.

[00:40:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Whether she fought the right direction, whether she ran in the opposite way.

[00:40:36] [SPEAKER_03]: It's kind of like, I don't know if you've ever watched those like little peewee, uh, football games where it's like these little, like eight, seven year olds playing and they'll grab the football and run the opposite direction.

[00:40:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Like, no, no, no, go, go the other way, go the other way.

[00:40:49] [SPEAKER_03]: Um, that's sometimes unfortunately how I felt Mackenzie was playing the game.

[00:40:52] [SPEAKER_03]: It was, and it was just Chelsea.

[00:40:54] [SPEAKER_03]: Actually our goalpost now is.

[00:40:56] [SPEAKER_03]: And so, um, for players like Cameron Rubina, unfortunately, I don't think there was as many excuses.

[00:41:02] [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, there's for me, um, unless you want to speak more Mackenzie on these portions, I was just going to liken it to with Rubina.

[00:41:10] [SPEAKER_03]: We've covered so much about Rubina on T cores and chemo's why they went home.

[00:41:15] [SPEAKER_03]: It's very similar to Rubina's because they were that trio who all played together.

[00:41:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Um, but I did appreciate her in the final and try to make some place in Mackenzie.

[00:41:25] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I wonder if there's a realm of where Rubina gets a couple votes and makes a competitive battle against Mackenzie.

[00:41:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Um, I like him to say yes, but more than camp, more than camp.

[00:41:39] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:41:39] [SPEAKER_02]: I would say that, and we'll get to cam in a moment here.

[00:41:44] [SPEAKER_02]: I would say Rubina had marginally more strategy than Cam did marginally, um, marginally, marginally, um, a lot of what we could say about Rubina.

[00:41:56] [SPEAKER_02]: We've already said about T core and chemo.

[00:41:57] [SPEAKER_02]: So I encourage people to go listen to those podcasts if they haven't already.

[00:42:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, it was a lot of the same thing.

[00:42:03] [SPEAKER_02]: The three of them hanging out together, talking about what they should do and then never doing it.

[00:42:07] [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, when she was nominated at various times, she either put up no fight or very little instead complaining to those close to her who couldn't change anything.

[00:42:16] [SPEAKER_02]: And she even said at one point, I feel like I wasn't cut out for this game.

[00:42:20] [SPEAKER_02]: And then later also said, I don't want the season to be in vain.

[00:42:23] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want backstabbing to win.

[00:42:25] [SPEAKER_02]: I want good people to win.

[00:42:27] [SPEAKER_02]: And of course she was one of the good people in question and wanted to change the game in that way.

[00:42:33] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, the thing is Rubina did have flashes of understanding more than Mackenzie did.

[00:42:39] [SPEAKER_02]: I would say she and chemo talked about how they had to go after people if they wanted to make it to the end.

[00:42:45] [SPEAKER_02]: And when she was up against chemo, she actually did something to keep herself in the game.

[00:42:51] [SPEAKER_02]: Unlike him, but it was minuscule compared to what she should have been doing.

[00:42:56] [SPEAKER_02]: And that really did show at the very end what you were talking about.

[00:42:59] [SPEAKER_02]: When she put off talking to Mackenzie day after day, when Mackenzie was literally the only vote, you didn't have to go around the whole house.

[00:43:08] [SPEAKER_02]: You had to talk to one person.

[00:43:10] [SPEAKER_02]: She kept planning to talk to her and then not doing it.

[00:43:13] [SPEAKER_02]: And she would literally see her hanging around and be like, maybe not now.

[00:43:19] [SPEAKER_02]: And then she finally did it so late in the week that Mackenzie was offended that she hadn't talked to her sooner.

[00:43:28] [SPEAKER_02]: And more importantly, the plan was already locked into Mackenzie's brain.

[00:43:33] [SPEAKER_02]: There was nothing Rubina could have said that was going to change it.

[00:43:37] [SPEAKER_02]: She could have said, you and I will get to the end.

[00:43:39] [SPEAKER_02]: And if I win, I will give you half.

[00:43:41] [SPEAKER_02]: And it would not have changed.

[00:43:45] [SPEAKER_03]: Which is so sad to hear because it's the truth in the matter of how it would have played out.

[00:43:51] [SPEAKER_03]: But the thing is, is that Rubina had the best.

[00:43:54] [SPEAKER_03]: She could have had the best argument.

[00:43:55] [SPEAKER_03]: And she she talks about a little too late, per se, but argument that, hey, like, if you take me out here.

[00:44:04] [SPEAKER_03]: Chelsea and Cam are essentially a duo.

[00:44:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Chelsea is the one to be right here.

[00:44:10] [SPEAKER_03]: Our best chances are probably you and I can make it here.

[00:44:14] [SPEAKER_03]: And even Cam's pitch to Mackenzie wasn't the greatest one where he was like, yeah, you know, I'll probably go with you.

[00:44:22] [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, we'll see.

[00:44:23] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it wasn't even believable.

[00:44:25] [SPEAKER_03]: So she had all the right was here.

[00:44:28] [SPEAKER_03]: And I want to think that maybe if Rubina was able to get to Mackenzie throughout the game and have some of those individual chess, especially when they were basically.

[00:44:37] [SPEAKER_03]: Let me just stop you there.

[00:44:39] [SPEAKER_02]: You say was able to.

[00:44:40] [SPEAKER_02]: She was able to.

[00:44:42] [SPEAKER_02]: She just did not do it.

[00:44:44] [SPEAKER_02]: Sorry, I just wanted to.

[00:44:46] [SPEAKER_02]: No, you're right.

[00:44:46] [SPEAKER_02]: You're right.

[00:44:47] [SPEAKER_03]: I appreciate you putting that input because she was with her along for a while.

[00:44:50] [SPEAKER_03]: That trio of people who stayed there.

[00:44:52] [SPEAKER_03]: She was the last of those trees.

[00:44:53] [SPEAKER_03]: There's a lot of time to bond with Mackenzie.

[00:44:55] [SPEAKER_03]: And also for a long time, Mackenzie was viewed as kind of a solo dolo player because she didn't really have quite a home within an alliance.

[00:45:03] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, she had an Angela group.

[00:45:05] [SPEAKER_03]: She had an Aligua group.

[00:45:06] [SPEAKER_03]: But then she was taking him out.

[00:45:08] [SPEAKER_03]: It would have been such a good time for them to connect.

[00:45:10] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, that was kind of our criticism with them for that key core team over being that trio that they kind of stayed so insulated.

[00:45:17] [SPEAKER_03]: But it just hurts to see that Rubina actually had the tools to kind of take those people who she played the game with and thumb in the jury.

[00:45:25] [SPEAKER_03]: So that's two locked votes in a jury of seven and kind of have a chance to make it to the end.

[00:45:31] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, she just needed Chelsea not to win out, which Chelsea didn't.

[00:45:35] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah.

[00:45:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, OK, we can move on to Cam pretty quickly here because there just isn't a whole lot to say about him in this rule.

[00:45:43] [SPEAKER_02]: I think he knew much of what was going on, but he mostly didn't take actions to affect the outcome of what that was.

[00:45:51] [SPEAKER_02]: As Chelsea told Mike Bloom, Cam was, in my mind, a terrible big brother player, but a great person.

[00:45:58] [SPEAKER_02]: But Taron said on the live feed recap early in the season, Cam had no knowledge of the game and wasn't trying.

[00:46:06] [SPEAKER_02]: He barely talked strategy, which attracted some negative attention early on.

[00:46:11] [SPEAKER_02]: But eventually that faded as he just became part of the furniture, you know, the chameleon, the chameleon, like his comic book character.

[00:46:20] [SPEAKER_02]: He did eventually start talking strategy, but it was almost always in service of whatever plan Chelsea had, like being a second voice in McKenzie's ear, telling her the same things as Chelsea had said or or babysitting for Chelsea, you know, babysitting McKenzie for Chelsea.

[00:46:39] [SPEAKER_02]: He occasionally had some influence on Chelsea, but I feel like it was usually more like a sounding board.

[00:46:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I don't know if you have those situations where it's like you talk something through and you realize that, oh, I should go a different way, even though the other person has barely said anything.

[00:46:56] [SPEAKER_02]: So he was there.

[00:46:59] [SPEAKER_02]: He may have made some points that helped convince her, but was it anything huge?

[00:47:04] [SPEAKER_02]: No, I mean.

[00:47:06] [SPEAKER_02]: It helped Chelsea, even when it was, it helped Chelsea to make a better move, you know.

[00:47:11] [SPEAKER_02]: So, and so as Angela told herself slash us at one point, Chelsea will do whatever she wants.

[00:47:20] [SPEAKER_02]: Cam will do whatever Chelsea wants.

[00:47:22] [SPEAKER_02]: And Chelsea even reamed him in a live feed camera talk this week, saying among other things that he did nothing all game.

[00:47:30] [SPEAKER_02]: He sits in a room staring and says two words and calls it game talk.

[00:47:38] [SPEAKER_03]: I have no doubt that Cam, I would be a great person probably to hang out with, enjoy some time.

[00:47:44] [SPEAKER_03]: In the context of the game, unfortunately, Cam truly was the best ally you want there because they will just be a vote for you.

[00:47:53] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, he, I have to imagine his vibes are just so great.

[00:47:58] [SPEAKER_03]: The people just wanted him around.

[00:47:59] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, because he didn't really try playing the game at all.

[00:48:03] [SPEAKER_03]: And like you said, it was interesting because he kind of knew what was going on.

[00:48:07] [SPEAKER_03]: It was just, he just didn't want to act on any moves to make.

[00:48:10] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, he kind of talked about, I know I need to make a move at the end and that move might be Chelsea using the McKenzie.

[00:48:17] [SPEAKER_03]: What she professes is that, no, I probably would have taken her to the end anyways when he was with his interview with Joey.

[00:48:23] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we see Cam play this version of a game where it's just like, all right, let's just like chill and see how far we can make it.

[00:48:30] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you have to be so bad at competitions in general.

[00:48:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, for your allies eventually turn on you and be like, I don't think, I don't think you're so bad at it.

[00:48:41] [SPEAKER_03]: I want to vote you out because you're making us mad.

[00:48:43] [SPEAKER_03]: And which is ironic that I love the juxtaposition of Cam being this like incredibly like strong man.

[00:48:49] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, this D1 athlete and he's sandwiched between McKenzie and Chelsea with their own right.

[00:48:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Look, very athletic and strong too.

[00:48:55] [SPEAKER_03]: But you wouldn't think if you told me before my best would have been lost.

[00:48:59] [SPEAKER_03]: If you told me McKenzie is going to win like 11 competitions, Chelsea is going to break or tie the HH wins in a season.

[00:49:07] [SPEAKER_03]: And then you have Cam right here who I think wins one competition the entire season.

[00:49:12] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, they got so upset that he wasn't pulling his weight.

[00:49:15] [SPEAKER_03]: They're like, we want to vote you out.

[00:49:17] [SPEAKER_03]: So, I mean, I guess Cam's ability was that like, it was good that he got any good with those two.

[00:49:23] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, like Angela said, I mean, he was a definition of a floater in this game.

[00:49:28] [SPEAKER_02]: I think he was a coaster.

[00:49:30] [SPEAKER_02]: A coaster.

[00:49:31] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:49:31] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, floater.

[00:49:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:49:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Something else.

[00:49:35] [SPEAKER_03]: He was a cam, you know?

[00:49:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[00:49:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[00:49:37] [SPEAKER_02]: He was the chameleon.

[00:49:41] [SPEAKER_02]: All right.

[00:49:43] [SPEAKER_02]: That's been a lot on the first rule.

[00:49:45] [SPEAKER_02]: And I can say that is the most time we will spend on any individual rule.

[00:49:49] [SPEAKER_02]: So, we can move on to the second rule, which says not to scheme and plot too much and to keep your scheming secret.

[00:49:54] [SPEAKER_02]: And as you might imagine, there isn't nearly as much to discuss here because, you know, three of our final four didn't scheme and plot anywhere near enough, let alone too much.

[00:50:04] [SPEAKER_02]: Even so, Chelsea, McKenzie and Rubina each had one minor issue with this rule that stood out to me.

[00:50:10] [SPEAKER_02]: So, I want to at least mention them.

[00:50:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Chelsea's goes back to mid-August, the time we talked about when she and Brooklyn were well positioned in the collective and the Pentagon, but got a bit too comfortable, which also caused their position to become too obvious.

[00:50:22] [SPEAKER_02]: That was a big part of the reason they were nominated together after things blew up on them.

[00:50:28] [SPEAKER_02]: But that was a true wake-up call for Chelsea, and it jolted her into a new game mode that she rode for the rest of the season.

[00:50:36] [SPEAKER_02]: So, she never made a mistake like that again.

[00:50:39] [SPEAKER_02]: Or, at least I should say she didn't make a mistake that she wasn't already guarding against.

[00:50:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Because by the time they were out in Jinky World, her trio with Cam and McKenzie was fairly obvious.

[00:50:53] [SPEAKER_02]: It's just that nobody could or would do anything about it because of how she maneuvered.

[00:50:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, no, very much so.

[00:51:00] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, she really kind of when she faltered that initial time and we say that, oh man, she might have overextended herself, she was quick to react and figure out how can I change anything.

[00:51:11] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that's also a big part of the game for most players.

[00:51:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Every player is going to overplay at some point or they're going to do something a little too much.

[00:51:19] [SPEAKER_03]: It's just kind of how do you handle that stumble.

[00:51:21] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's why I think it was really fun to watch Chelsea play this game is that she was the type of player where we've seen certain players, you know, they stay in a position and kind of fight their way up.

[00:51:31] [SPEAKER_03]: Eventually, they get there where they play such a perfect game where they were never touched, you know.

[00:51:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Chelsea flittered with me.

[00:51:36] [SPEAKER_03]: She wasn't scared of being around the fire.

[00:51:38] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, and when she learned it, like she's like, oh, this, you know, I have a little niece.

[00:51:44] [SPEAKER_03]: And so she was just walking around and stuff like that.

[00:51:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And she just realized what static shock does when you rub on the carpet too much and things like that.

[00:51:50] [SPEAKER_03]: She's like, oh, all right, I'm not going to do that.

[00:51:52] [SPEAKER_03]: And to liken that with Chelsea in the sense that like when she made that mistake, she's like, oh, I'm not going to do that.

[00:51:56] [SPEAKER_03]: I know my boundaries.

[00:51:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Let me figure out a way around it.

[00:51:59] [SPEAKER_03]: So it's very cool to see that play.

[00:52:02] [SPEAKER_03]: But I mean, yes, we did see.

[00:52:04] [SPEAKER_03]: I will, and I'll wait for this, but I do have some points for the other players, especially McKenzie.

[00:52:08] [SPEAKER_03]: I actually think she flittered on the wrong side of this.

[00:52:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:52:13] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:52:14] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, another group that was obvious was, of course, the foursome of Rubina, Tucker, T-Core, and Kimo.

[00:52:21] [SPEAKER_02]: At that time, it was funny that Rubina was oblivious to the fact they came off as the tight four they were.

[00:52:29] [SPEAKER_02]: She was surprised by this idea, just as she was later somewhat taken aback when she and Kimo would get put up on the block against each other.

[00:52:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Her allies through the game were always so obvious.

[00:52:43] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, very much.

[00:52:44] [SPEAKER_03]: So it was in each other's face.

[00:52:46] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, from the showmance to the connections of, you know, they only converse with one another.

[00:52:52] [SPEAKER_03]: If anything, I know on finale night, it was a big shocker for a lot of the houses that Tucker was the person who was sending those secret messages.

[00:52:58] [SPEAKER_03]: But if anything, it was kind of one of the smarter ideas Tucker had in place.

[00:53:03] [SPEAKER_03]: It worked out well.

[00:53:04] [SPEAKER_03]: And unfortunately, she didn't as well.

[00:53:05] [SPEAKER_03]: But the idea of how do we hide us or kind of put it away or just push it all in the open if it's already in there, you know?

[00:53:15] [SPEAKER_03]: I like that.

[00:53:16] [SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, for Rubina, she didn't try to hide it.

[00:53:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[00:53:20] [SPEAKER_02]: And then as for Mackenzie, her over-scheming came way back in the first week.

[00:53:24] [SPEAKER_02]: I mentioned already in the first rule that she talked about wanting Angela out before nominations even happened.

[00:53:29] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, she told various people that Angela was a huge social threat and needed to go soon.

[00:53:35] [SPEAKER_02]: I said it before.

[00:53:36] [SPEAKER_02]: She really was lucky to have made it past that early stage of the game.

[00:53:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I would say because a big part of this rule is like you don't backstab until you need to.

[00:53:45] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think unfortunately for Mackenzie, for me, she did this too much when she didn't need to with the Leah situation.

[00:53:51] [SPEAKER_03]: I know some people will be like, hey, oh, look at where she went and she made this far.

[00:53:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, to our argument, she made that because Chelsea was really the one maneuvering that.

[00:54:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Leah would have been a proponent against Chelsea.

[00:54:03] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think we've been able to convince Mackenzie one way or the other, like, hey, we should get her out.

[00:54:09] [SPEAKER_03]: And with Leah there, I think that changes the dynamic for Mackenzie because then she has a lot more openings to the end.

[00:54:15] [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't think Leah really backstabbed Mackenzie.

[00:54:18] [SPEAKER_03]: And I also think the way Mackenzie would Angela relationship after she put so much capital to kind of keep Angela around and her getting that ally or contributing to it was a big part of like,

[00:54:29] [SPEAKER_03]: why do you bring these people along with you in the game to kind of just cut them off when you don't need to?

[00:54:34] [SPEAKER_03]: And I, you know, I think that also bitter the jury.

[00:54:37] [SPEAKER_03]: I truly think that because she cut Leah that way, Queen was offended for Leah's behalf against Mackenzie.

[00:54:45] [SPEAKER_02]: I think there was some of that.

[00:54:46] [SPEAKER_02]: We'll get to more of that, you know, later, of course.

[00:54:48] [SPEAKER_02]: But I'd like to think anyway that Quinn was looking at it more from game mode.

[00:54:54] [SPEAKER_02]: But yes, you know, he definitely was more upset at Mackenzie for doing it than Leah was herself, you know.

[00:55:01] [SPEAKER_02]: All right.

[00:55:02] [SPEAKER_02]: We could go to the third rule, which talks about the need to be flexible.

[00:55:05] [SPEAKER_02]: How do you think?

[00:55:06] [SPEAKER_02]: How do you think Chelsea?

[00:55:08] [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing for Cam, right?

[00:55:09] [SPEAKER_00]: No, I mean, he barely schemed.

[00:55:12] [SPEAKER_00]: How could he over scheme?

[00:55:13] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, we need him to backstep more.

[00:55:15] [SPEAKER_00]: That was what we needed.

[00:55:16] [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, exactly.

[00:55:16] [SPEAKER_00]: He did.

[00:55:18] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:55:20] [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, okay.

[00:55:20] [SPEAKER_00]: The rule number three.

[00:55:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:55:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:55:22] [SPEAKER_02]: How do you think Chelsea did in terms of being flexible?

[00:55:24] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I think I touched about this before too.

[00:55:27] [SPEAKER_03]: I really think she did really well, especially on that initial blunder with that whole week with Brooklyn,

[00:55:31] [SPEAKER_03]: seeing her allies go home and then seeing Cedric kind of be shipped away.

[00:55:37] [SPEAKER_03]: She was kind of, you know, and I always say this, you know, this is kind of where we go back and forth on it,

[00:55:41] [SPEAKER_03]: that to show your flexibility, you need to be tested on it.

[00:55:43] [SPEAKER_03]: And we saw that she was tested on it.

[00:55:45] [SPEAKER_03]: But I also don't want to liken her flexibility just to that moment where she gets her game back on track.

[00:55:49] [SPEAKER_03]: It's throughout the whole end game and the last six weeks, especially with her relationship with T-Core,

[00:55:56] [SPEAKER_03]: when she knew when she need to kind of put a little pressure to ensure that, hey, I'm good with you, Trio, right?

[00:56:01] [SPEAKER_03]: Your votes aren't against me.

[00:56:02] [SPEAKER_03]: If you need to get somebody else, get them, but not me.

[00:56:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And then when T-Core was in danger, her trying to help out, but didn't realize, you know what?

[00:56:09] [SPEAKER_03]: This might be a time for me to cut my losses here because out of this trio, T-Core might be the only one who actually flips on me.

[00:56:15] [SPEAKER_03]: These other two might not.

[00:56:16] [SPEAKER_03]: So, I mean, she was a masterclass, I actually think, in this category, the more I think about it,

[00:56:24] [SPEAKER_03]: because of the way she was able to maneuver herself.

[00:56:26] [SPEAKER_03]: What do you think, David?

[00:56:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I agree.

[00:56:27] [SPEAKER_02]: She set herself up great, obviously.

[00:56:29] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, and you mentioned earlier that, you know, for a while she was essentially in the middle of the house.

[00:56:34] [SPEAKER_02]: Everyone, she was safe with everyone.

[00:56:36] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, she had the T-Core trio on one side, a more jumbled group of individuals and duos on the other side.

[00:56:43] [SPEAKER_02]: But no matter who was in power, she was fine.

[00:56:47] [SPEAKER_02]: And this was one of the things she discussed in her jury responses and speech,

[00:56:51] [SPEAKER_02]: that a major way she avoided ever being put on the block.

[00:56:55] [SPEAKER_02]: So she didn't have to worry about winning comps to save her life.

[00:56:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Most of the other players didn't even seem to notice it.

[00:57:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Quinn did, as he at one point told Leah that if one of them win HOH,

[00:57:07] [SPEAKER_02]: they are going to have to have a delicate conversation with Cam and McKenzie about Chelsea playing the middle.

[00:57:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, frankly, I mean, that talk never happened.

[00:57:15] [SPEAKER_02]: But if it had, I don't think it would have mattered because Chelsea set herself up so well.

[00:57:22] [SPEAKER_02]: Even as late as the final three, she was with two players who were pretty much guaranteed to take her to the end so she could win.

[00:57:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, she, we were talking about the forehead, but kind of the Richard Hatch version of Survivor where no matter,

[00:57:41] [SPEAKER_03]: he steps off the final immunity challenge where basically, hey, one of you guys have to take me up there.

[00:57:47] [SPEAKER_03]: That's what she was able to do at the end.

[00:57:48] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, very impressive.

[00:57:50] [SPEAKER_03]: And that doesn't happen from somebody who doesn't decide to be able to figure out how she does things.

[00:57:55] [SPEAKER_03]: But here's the thing I will say one last thing on this portion is that I think so many players go into the house saying like,

[00:57:59] [SPEAKER_03]: I want to stay within my code.

[00:58:02] [SPEAKER_03]: I have a principle with it.

[00:58:03] [SPEAKER_03]: She had her principle.

[00:58:04] [SPEAKER_03]: She played within her means.

[00:58:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Chelsea said, this is a game.

[00:58:07] [SPEAKER_03]: This is how I'm going to play it.

[00:58:09] [SPEAKER_03]: And this is what I'm going to do there.

[00:58:10] [SPEAKER_03]: We saw her exactly do that.

[00:58:12] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that's the best version for a player to be flexible.

[00:58:16] [SPEAKER_03]: It's like, give yourself the bandwidth.

[00:58:18] [SPEAKER_03]: You would tell yourself you're not going to lie going into this game.

[00:58:20] [SPEAKER_03]: When you tell yourself you're not going to do A, B, and C because you're worried about this and that.

[00:58:24] [SPEAKER_03]: And again, I'm talking about game-wise.

[00:58:26] [SPEAKER_03]: There's things outside of the game that don't need to be needed in there.

[00:58:28] [SPEAKER_03]: But what's the game reason?

[00:58:31] [SPEAKER_03]: You should allow yourself to have that flexibility.

[00:58:33] [SPEAKER_03]: So we're seeing players that we're about to talk about who are so inflexible is because they didn't allow themselves to even have the option to do that.

[00:58:40] [SPEAKER_03]: They didn't say, hey, I want you to do it.

[00:58:42] [SPEAKER_02]: Just say McKenzie.

[00:58:42] [SPEAKER_02]: Just say McKenzie.

[00:58:43] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you know, I mean.

[00:58:46] [SPEAKER_03]: But I think it was Rubina as well.

[00:58:48] [SPEAKER_03]: McKenzie, Rubina.

[00:58:49] [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't know.

[00:58:50] [SPEAKER_03]: I want to say Cameron.

[00:58:51] [SPEAKER_03]: He just didn't care.

[00:58:52] [SPEAKER_03]: So I think he was okay with doing it.

[00:58:53] [SPEAKER_03]: He just didn't care to do it, you know.

[00:58:56] [SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, McKenzie and Rubina for sure.

[00:58:57] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean.

[00:58:58] [SPEAKER_02]: So I guess should I even ask you about McKenzie?

[00:59:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Because she made it clear over and over and in her interviews that she was.

[00:59:06] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you likened someone to a brick earlier this season when it came to flexibility.

[00:59:11] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, if anyone was a brick, it was McKenzie.

[00:59:15] [SPEAKER_02]: She just wanted to stick to her so-called loyalty and morals.

[00:59:19] [SPEAKER_03]: She was.

[00:59:20] [SPEAKER_03]: She was.

[00:59:20] [SPEAKER_03]: And she wasn't just a brick.

[00:59:21] [SPEAKER_03]: She was a wall of bricks cemented together with titanium and some added things there.

[00:59:26] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, this is the stuff they put in front of houses.

[00:59:30] [SPEAKER_03]: So soft floods.

[00:59:31] [SPEAKER_03]: You're not getting through McKenzie with that.

[00:59:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:59:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's so unfortunate because if there was one rule if we changed for somebody for them to actually potentially win the game, it would have been this rule.

[00:59:42] [SPEAKER_03]: If McKenzie is just more flexible, especially at the end, I think she leaves with $750,000.

[00:59:48] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:59:49] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:59:50] [SPEAKER_02]: So, you know, was there anything to discuss about Cam here?

[00:59:55] [SPEAKER_03]: He didn't need to be flexible.

[00:59:57] [SPEAKER_03]: He did.

[00:59:58] [SPEAKER_03]: There was no test for him to be flexible.

[00:59:59] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, the moment when Chelsea kept him out of the vote and kept his initial game, like a pre-jury.

[01:00:09] [SPEAKER_03]: And then she was like, I'm sorry I had to do this to you.

[01:00:11] [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, that sucks.

[01:00:12] [SPEAKER_03]: I wish you let me in here.

[01:00:13] [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, maybe I shouldn't trust her.

[01:00:14] [SPEAKER_03]: And then he goes back to trust me.

[01:00:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[01:00:16] [SPEAKER_03]: We realized that was going to be a history game for you.

[01:00:18] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[01:00:20] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, for Rubina, I'll just say, you know, I said it for Kimo.

[01:00:24] [SPEAKER_02]: She had one alliance without any sub-alliances or side alliances.

[01:00:27] [SPEAKER_02]: So, again, not flexible at all.

[01:00:31] [SPEAKER_02]: All right.

[01:00:32] [SPEAKER_02]: We'll go to the fourth rule then, which says players should not let their emotions control them.

[01:00:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Chelsea certainly understood the importance of this rule, though sometimes she did let her emotions run away with her a bit,

[01:00:43] [SPEAKER_02]: especially when it came to Cam and a couple of the women.

[01:00:46] [SPEAKER_02]: It looked a lot like jealousy, but she later claimed in interviews that it was more because she worried he'd screw up their strategic position.

[01:00:56] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if I buy that.

[01:00:59] [SPEAKER_02]: But even with it happening a couple of times, she did move past her anger fairly quickly.

[01:01:05] [SPEAKER_02]: Sometimes it took a few days.

[01:01:06] [SPEAKER_02]: But even in the game of Big Brother, a few days is fairly quickly.

[01:01:10] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, and she told Cam at one point when Cam said, well, I'm a little worried about you being mad at me.

[01:01:16] [SPEAKER_02]: And she said she had never made a game move out of anger.

[01:01:19] [SPEAKER_02]: And she's she's right.

[01:01:21] [SPEAKER_02]: She didn't.

[01:01:22] [SPEAKER_02]: And on the flip side, she also didn't make any game moves out of the, you know, the good side of emotion.

[01:01:30] [SPEAKER_02]: We say there are two sides, you know, like.

[01:01:33] [SPEAKER_02]: When she was planning to vote out Quinn, she cried a bit.

[01:01:37] [SPEAKER_02]: But then she pulled herself together because she knew and she told herself Quinn would make a game decision.

[01:01:44] [SPEAKER_02]: I have to make a game decision.

[01:01:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think she's a really good example of a player that has emotions, but she doesn't let them control her.

[01:01:53] [SPEAKER_05]: Right.

[01:01:53] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, and I mean that by game logic.

[01:01:56] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, here's the everyone has their feelings.

[01:01:58] [SPEAKER_03]: You just only so much you can do about, you know, having a crush on somebody or feeling this way about that.

[01:02:04] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[01:02:04] [SPEAKER_03]: But letting that impact the game.

[01:02:07] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't really think she did too much.

[01:02:08] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, yes, she'd have a conversation, too.

[01:02:10] [SPEAKER_03]: And maybe we would have a different conversation if some of the other players had got back to Cam.

[01:02:13] [SPEAKER_03]: And Cam was like, oh, I can't trust her anymore.

[01:02:15] [SPEAKER_03]: That never happened.

[01:02:17] [SPEAKER_03]: And so, you know, unlike a player like Angela, who really let her emotions completely control her game, where when she got upset, she's going at somebody.

[01:02:26] [SPEAKER_03]: McKenzie, excuse me, Chelsea was the polar opposite of that.

[01:02:31] [SPEAKER_03]: So, you know, it was good to see because I think that's what we ranked her.

[01:02:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I was worried about two initially from their interviews and talking about it, how they're going to do this and that, whether this would be an issue was not an issue at all.

[01:02:42] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:02:42] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, McKenzie's whole game was more like Angela's, totally based on emotion.

[01:02:47] [SPEAKER_02]: And yes, she called it loyalty or whatever.

[01:02:50] [SPEAKER_02]: It boils down to emotion, which is one reason she was so easy to manipulate for Chelsea and for others if they had tried.

[01:03:00] [SPEAKER_02]: The biggest and most obvious example of this was her final decision to evict Cam and give away $675,000.

[01:03:07] [SPEAKER_02]: She could claim all she wants about her choice, you know, whatever she wants.

[01:03:13] [SPEAKER_02]: But the fact is, it was all emotion.

[01:03:15] [SPEAKER_02]: And the way she's talked about it continues to prove that.

[01:03:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Plus, these emotions were stoked even further by Chelsea over the course of weeks.

[01:03:24] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want to get too much into this.

[01:03:28] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think it's a coincidence that Chelsea and McKenzie appear to have similar religious views.

[01:03:35] [SPEAKER_02]: And I think once Chelsea realized that, I think, and similar views about family and the importance of family.

[01:03:42] [SPEAKER_02]: And I think Chelsea was able to use that to connect with McKenzie even more.

[01:03:50] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, then some other people might have.

[01:03:54] [SPEAKER_02]: I do think McKenzie was, as I said earlier, clay for someone to mold in her hand.

[01:03:58] [SPEAKER_02]: And Chelsea was extremely good at that.

[01:04:01] [SPEAKER_02]: But there were even extra things that Chelsea picked out.

[01:04:04] [SPEAKER_02]: Ooh, I can use this as an emotional lever against her.

[01:04:09] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, that's an interesting take, I think, David.

[01:04:11] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, but I do say I think that she definitely connected with her through those things.

[01:04:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Whether it was the trauma within the house.

[01:04:18] [SPEAKER_03]: Whether it was the similar values that they hold in their personal lives.

[01:04:23] [SPEAKER_03]: She was able to reinforce that we have a very strong bond.

[01:04:27] [SPEAKER_03]: We have a sisterly bond.

[01:04:28] [SPEAKER_03]: And we should go to the end together.

[01:04:31] [SPEAKER_03]: And for, like we said before, with McKenzie, she was playing the game and operating game under no knowledge of the game in a way.

[01:04:38] [SPEAKER_03]: And she expected that Chelsea, all the moves she's doing for Chelsea, because, of course, since we have all these connections in our personal lives,

[01:04:45] [SPEAKER_03]: they're probably thinking out for me as well.

[01:04:47] [SPEAKER_03]: It's a beneficial thing, a two-way beneficial thing.

[01:04:49] [SPEAKER_03]: And if anything, it was a beneficial thing for McKenzie in so many ways.

[01:04:53] [SPEAKER_03]: It got her all the way to final two.

[01:04:55] [SPEAKER_03]: It was just that she needed to be able to make that cut.

[01:04:57] [SPEAKER_03]: And I have to believe that Chelsea won that final HOS, she would have made that cut very quickly, too.

[01:05:02] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I don't think she would have made the cut.

[01:05:04] [SPEAKER_02]: She said she was going.

[01:05:06] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, she said in all her interviews that she was going with McKenzie to the end.

[01:05:11] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it's easy to say that at the end, you know, and not want to turn.

[01:05:16] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.

[01:05:17] [SPEAKER_02]: You will never know.

[01:05:19] [SPEAKER_02]: You will never know.

[01:05:20] [SPEAKER_03]: I just think it's one of those things that at this point, she would never get any more favor from like she's, you know, saying I wouldn't take McKenzie.

[01:05:27] [SPEAKER_03]: It's like I would find it hard if one of my friends, my good friend, she probably still cares about it, took me to the end and basically gifted me $750.

[01:05:35] [SPEAKER_03]: And me to turn around and be like, I wouldn't have taken them, you know?

[01:05:37] [SPEAKER_03]: So who knows?

[01:05:38] [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe it's completely valid.

[01:05:40] [SPEAKER_03]: But I like to think that she would have made the game move.

[01:05:43] [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm like, you know what?

[01:05:44] [SPEAKER_03]: I know who I need to take.

[01:05:45] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:05:46] [SPEAKER_02]: I do want to give one other example because I mentioned a couple things about McKenzie being, you know, being susceptible to emotional manipulation, for lack of a better term.

[01:06:00] [SPEAKER_02]: And another good example was the Leah situation.

[01:06:03] [SPEAKER_02]: She was friends with Leah.

[01:06:04] [SPEAKER_02]: She would not flip on her until Chelsea gave her information supposedly proving that Leah was the bad one.

[01:06:12] [SPEAKER_02]: She was going around lying.

[01:06:14] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, lying is bad.

[01:06:15] [SPEAKER_02]: You don't want that.

[01:06:17] [SPEAKER_02]: And then that convinced McKenzie that finally got McKenzie over the hump to go ahead and flip on her, put Leah on the block.

[01:06:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, then Leah came back to her.

[01:06:29] [SPEAKER_02]: They mended fences.

[01:06:30] [SPEAKER_02]: They ironed things out.

[01:06:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it was all a misunderstanding.

[01:06:33] [SPEAKER_02]: And McKenzie didn't want her to leave anymore.

[01:06:35] [SPEAKER_02]: But it was too late.

[01:06:36] [SPEAKER_02]: The deed was done.

[01:06:42] [SPEAKER_03]: Back to not understanding how the game works is that at some point it's out of HOH's control.

[01:06:47] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, once you make the decision, it's not just you have the power for the entire week.

[01:06:51] [SPEAKER_03]: And so one of the things you probably should realize, but it's one of the, I think from her side, she was thinking that Chelsea knows this game is steering me in a correct way.

[01:07:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Like if I need it back out, I can back it.

[01:07:02] [SPEAKER_03]: No, the deposit signed and checked.

[01:07:04] [SPEAKER_03]: It's already sent over there.

[01:07:05] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, you already zelled them.

[01:07:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Banks like we can't get your money back.

[01:07:08] [SPEAKER_03]: You sent it over there.

[01:07:10] [SPEAKER_03]: It's in the cautionary part where you send this money to go.

[01:07:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Do you have any thoughts, though, of our other fellow house guests who lost?

[01:07:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I mean, you know, for Rubina, you could probably guess what my answer is going to be.

[01:07:25] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, much like Kimo, she was almost all emotion.

[01:07:28] [SPEAKER_02]: I said Kimo was 99%.

[01:07:31] [SPEAKER_02]: I would give Rubina maybe 96 or 95 because there was a little bit more strategy to her than him.

[01:07:38] [SPEAKER_02]: But she also landed herself in a showmance that could have easily ended her game instead of Tucker's.

[01:07:44] [SPEAKER_02]: And then she was in the trio that was all about having each other as friends.

[01:07:48] [SPEAKER_02]: So that's why I really can't go any lower than 96 or 95%.

[01:07:52] [SPEAKER_03]: I think that's a good number right there for her.

[01:07:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think unfortunately a lot of her game did follow by how she felt.

[01:08:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Like you said, there was strategy involved when she needed to get herself off the block.

[01:08:05] [SPEAKER_03]: I think the issue was is that since her game revolved so much around those emotions that when it did come time to the end game,

[01:08:13] [SPEAKER_03]: since she didn't really connect to McKenzie already in such a way, like how you likened Chelsea and McKenzie's relationship,

[01:08:19] [SPEAKER_03]: there wasn't much positive form of that to make the strategy.

[01:08:25] [SPEAKER_03]: And then Cam Malone, I think the emotions that control, he was excited for the dogs at the crib.

[01:08:31] [SPEAKER_03]: That's every week we want to give him a shout out.

[01:08:33] [SPEAKER_03]: That was his goal.

[01:08:34] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, the one thing I will say for him that stands out, you know,

[01:08:38] [SPEAKER_02]: is that after the big Tucker Rubina kissing reveal, you know, when they made a big show of it,

[01:08:44] [SPEAKER_02]: he pulled aside McKenzie and Chelsea and he said, I'm glad you guys aren't swayed by that emotional effing moment.

[01:08:51] [SPEAKER_02]: And so I was both surprised and happy to see him thinking that way, like specifically thinking like,

[01:08:58] [SPEAKER_02]: we're not going to change our plans just because the two of them had a happy, you know, have a happy romance going on.

[01:09:06] [SPEAKER_02]: That may have been his most strategic moment the whole game.

[01:09:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, he had that.

[01:09:11] [SPEAKER_03]: And who knows, maybe without Chelsea there, Cam comes out as the mastermind of everything, you know,

[01:09:16] [SPEAKER_03]: in another parallel world.

[01:09:18] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, yes.

[01:09:20] [SPEAKER_02]: All right, we can go to the fifth rule, which says players need to pretend to be nice and play the social game.

[01:09:24] [SPEAKER_02]: And Chelsea credited her social game several times during her final two Q&A and speech.

[01:09:30] [SPEAKER_02]: But a lot of what she attributed to social game, I would call strategic game instead.

[01:09:35] [SPEAKER_02]: And we've already been over that.

[01:09:36] [SPEAKER_02]: And it's not just her.

[01:09:37] [SPEAKER_02]: A lot of people just lump social game into everything.

[01:09:41] [SPEAKER_02]: But when you're planning, like who to align with and all that, that's the strategic.

[01:09:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Still, even so, she did have a great social game as well.

[01:09:50] [SPEAKER_02]: She had to.

[01:09:51] [SPEAKER_02]: After all, she started out in the worst position as a powerless microchip cheerleader in the first week.

[01:09:58] [SPEAKER_02]: And she used her social game to get in good with HOH Angela.

[01:10:02] [SPEAKER_02]: She continued in that way for most of the rest of the season with the occasional glitch I mentioned earlier.

[01:10:08] [SPEAKER_02]: Again, I consider a lot of that to be strategic in terms of getting on the good side of the right people.

[01:10:15] [SPEAKER_02]: But she had to use her social abilities to make it happen.

[01:10:19] [SPEAKER_02]: And, of course, as she said, she positioned herself.

[01:10:21] [SPEAKER_02]: So she was with the people who wanted to take her to the end.

[01:10:25] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, in Mackenzie's case especially, she said in interviews that it developed into a deep friendship where each was going to take the other.

[01:10:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, of course, it's easier to be in that kind of friendship when you're on the side that's going to win.

[01:10:39] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, when you continue to make game moves like convincing Mackenzie she didn't need to prepare a speech and claiming you didn't have one ready when you'd actually been working on one for days already.

[01:10:52] [SPEAKER_02]: So that's where the social and strategic kind of merge.

[01:10:55] [SPEAKER_02]: It's like she was great friends with Mackenzie, but Mackenzie is going to look back and find out Chelsea was lying to her for days, setting her up for failure at the final two.

[01:11:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Well said. I think that with Chelsea's game, because the way, you know, I see is that the strategic portion of it is kind of putting the calculations together.

[01:11:16] [SPEAKER_03]: And then your social game is the execution of it.

[01:11:19] [SPEAKER_03]: And you need kind of a hand in hand, both of those in some shape or form.

[01:11:23] [SPEAKER_03]: We've seen some players be incredibly strategic and social, a little less.

[01:11:26] [SPEAKER_03]: Or some people be so social and very less strategic.

[01:11:29] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I think this season's kind of been a very polarized version of one or the other.

[01:11:34] [SPEAKER_03]: One thing we saw with Chelsea, she was able to do both.

[01:11:37] [SPEAKER_03]: I think, you know, to her credit, right?

[01:11:39] [SPEAKER_03]: Like, yes, you can be strategic and figure out how do you, who you should align with.

[01:11:44] [SPEAKER_03]: You have the outline with it.

[01:11:45] [SPEAKER_03]: But her ability can really bring Mackenzie under her wing, can be trusting her as T-Core on the other side, be like kind of her ally there.

[01:11:54] [SPEAKER_03]: And in initial weeks, have Cedric right there with her too.

[01:11:57] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, oh, and then lastly, have Angelina initial week make sure not to target her.

[01:12:01] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, she was able to maneuver herself in a really good way because she got along with people and always made it so that there were other people around her who seemed a lot less liked around, like as a shield there.

[01:12:15] [SPEAKER_03]: So I think she was conscious of like her ability to connect with people.

[01:12:20] [SPEAKER_03]: But I love that she didn't rely on it to get out of that situation.

[01:12:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:12:24] [SPEAKER_03]: She set herself up for success.

[01:12:26] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:12:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:12:28] [SPEAKER_02]: I do feel like, you know, there are probably lots of examples we could go through here, but there are only so many ways to say she did an excellent job here.

[01:12:34] [SPEAKER_02]: So, you know, we can move on to Mackenzie, who had a number of bumps in the road with her social game.

[01:12:41] [SPEAKER_02]: She had problems with it early on after the Matt fiasco and then, you know, had some issues trying to make closer relationships.

[01:12:49] [SPEAKER_02]: Part of it goes back to what we discussed in the first rule about that.

[01:12:54] [SPEAKER_02]: She didn't really know how to approach people.

[01:12:57] [SPEAKER_02]: And for a while, she was actually a bit off putting to some people like Leah, who, you know, she'd eventually become good friends with her.

[01:13:06] [SPEAKER_02]: But earlier on, Leah was complaining about the way Mackenzie would follow her and do whatever she was doing and mirroring her mannerism and stealing her jokes.

[01:13:17] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, obviously, she got past it.

[01:13:19] [SPEAKER_02]: But at one point, Leah actually talked about that as a reason she wanted to vote Mackenzie out.

[01:13:26] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, with Leah, she disliked half the people for no reason sometimes.

[01:13:31] [SPEAKER_03]: That's true.

[01:13:31] [SPEAKER_03]: So I don't always put her.

[01:13:33] [SPEAKER_02]: She would just say, oh, they give me the ek.

[01:13:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly.

[01:13:37] [SPEAKER_03]: So I try not to use Leah as the barometer of social game.

[01:13:41] [SPEAKER_03]: I like, you know, for Mackenzie-wise, she had the opposite problem because she had no strategic stuff.

[01:13:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Her social game wasn't as high as her physical game, the way she was doing competition, but was still there.

[01:13:53] [SPEAKER_03]: She just didn't know where to execute, where she was able to kind of do certain measures.

[01:13:56] [SPEAKER_03]: But when she pressed execution, she was already steered to the wrong area.

[01:14:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Let's get Leah out.

[01:14:01] [SPEAKER_03]: Let's get Angela out.

[01:14:02] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, let's use a veto right here.

[01:14:03] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, she, I think, was able to mesh herself into these groups because people found her likable.

[01:14:10] [SPEAKER_03]: And as a whole, she didn't do too much to rub people the wrong way as the game continued on after we got a little past the prejure and even initial ends of it.

[01:14:19] [SPEAKER_03]: So I can't give her too bad of a grade in this version because she seemed she was able to still connect with people.

[01:14:26] [SPEAKER_03]: The issue was is that she had no strategy behind the socializing.

[01:14:29] [SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[01:14:30] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you know, with that said, Mackenzie obviously did eventually find a home with Chelsea, but I wouldn't even credit that to her own social game.

[01:14:39] [SPEAKER_02]: It was because of Chelsea's along with a strong dose of Chelsea's strategic game to keep a grip on Mackenzie.

[01:14:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Like I said, now, still, as I mentioned, it did become a friendship.

[01:14:49] [SPEAKER_02]: And as it got near the end of the season, we often saw them griping to each other about other people like Cam, but not the other way around.

[01:14:57] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I don't remember like seeing Chelsea gripe to Cam about Mackenzie.

[01:15:02] [SPEAKER_02]: So there is that.

[01:15:04] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:15:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Speaking of Cam, his social game was about his only game.

[01:15:10] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, he seems to be a really, really nice guy.

[01:15:14] [SPEAKER_02]: Even in the first few days, Quinn mentioned how cool Cam was and said, I love him.

[01:15:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Every time he talks, I feel so good.

[01:15:22] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, of course, Cam or Quinn wasn't the only one feeling good about Cam as some of the women did, like Leah Early and then a couple others who were flirting and cuddling with him.

[01:15:34] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, at one point he turned on his social game even more because he found out that if Brooklyn had won the AI arena, he might have gone home.

[01:15:45] [SPEAKER_02]: And he told Mike Bloom, I definitely switched up the social game for sure.

[01:15:50] [SPEAKER_02]: I went more chill.

[01:15:52] [SPEAKER_02]: I went way more for the non-threatening approach, using the social game and getting close to people.

[01:15:58] [SPEAKER_03]: Hey, I mean, he really amped up that non-threatening version of himself.

[01:16:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, he did.

[01:16:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Not winning any competitions there.

[01:16:07] [SPEAKER_03]: But no, like I said in the beginning, if there's nothing else, I think Cam seemed like a person you'd want to just hang out with.

[01:16:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, he's cast. He seems like a great guy.

[01:16:14] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think other people caught that vibe too.

[01:16:17] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, like people got annoyed that he wasn't winning this competition or that.

[01:16:19] [SPEAKER_03]: But I think it's impressive for him to actually get as far as he did without –

[01:16:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Like he would have been the ultimate no blood on my hands person to put on the block or something like that because at that point, the connections he had –

[01:16:31] [SPEAKER_03]: No one was going to go out the bathroom.

[01:16:33] [SPEAKER_03]: No one would be like, oh, no, Cam is gone, my closest ally.

[01:16:36] [SPEAKER_03]: Chelsea might be, but she would have been like, it's okay, I'll let it go.

[01:16:40] [SPEAKER_03]: So, yeah, he was able to maneuver himself in the conversations.

[01:16:43] [SPEAKER_03]: Everyone felt at ease with him.

[01:16:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's the thing we talk about.

[01:16:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Like we're not here to evaluate lost potential, but if Cam literally tried to start making moves through it and start –

[01:16:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Because he was in the positions too.

[01:16:54] [SPEAKER_03]: He was in those groups.

[01:16:55] [SPEAKER_03]: If he just started taking the steering wheel just a little bit and say, hey, I need to figure this out.

[01:17:00] [SPEAKER_03]: And he would have had a great story if he would start making moves behind the scenes where he's like,

[01:17:03] [SPEAKER_03]: I didn't even need these competition wins to be able to get myself further in this game.

[01:17:09] [SPEAKER_03]: So, unfortunately, we just didn't see anything else though.

[01:17:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:17:13] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, Rubina, of course, was great socially and everybody loved her.

[01:17:16] [SPEAKER_02]: Some or one in a more literal sense.

[01:17:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Indeed, it was her social game that made T-Cor and Kimo flip against Cedric to keep her.

[01:17:26] [SPEAKER_02]: It sure wasn't her strategic game that did it.

[01:17:30] [SPEAKER_02]: Rubina was also the member of the trio who was most likely to talk to people outside of that trio.

[01:17:36] [SPEAKER_02]: That gave her a bit more social standing and helped contribute to her being the last member of that group in the game.

[01:17:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:17:44] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, she – that was really – she maxed out her stats in the social game.

[01:17:47] [SPEAKER_03]: She was really good at converging with different people.

[01:17:51] [SPEAKER_03]: My only regret is I wish she just did that to make connections outside of the trio.

[01:17:55] [SPEAKER_03]: But that's kind of our biggest regret for each of these players, that they're actually such lovable people.

[01:18:00] [SPEAKER_03]: They seem like T-Cor, Kimo, and Rubina.

[01:18:02] [SPEAKER_03]: I hate lumping them all three together, but when they only connected with all three of them,

[01:18:06] [SPEAKER_03]: and when you look at our – why T-Cor lost, why Kimo lost, and kind of what Rubina,

[01:18:09] [SPEAKER_03]: it's all the same reasons.

[01:18:11] [SPEAKER_03]: It's because they did not leave the group of people.

[01:18:13] [SPEAKER_03]: So, if she did try doing that, I think we would have seen a lot more success for her down the line.

[01:18:18] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and that leads us nicely to the sixth rule, which warns against being too much of a threat.

[01:18:22] [SPEAKER_02]: So, since we were just talking about Rubina's social game, let's continue with that here in this rule,

[01:18:26] [SPEAKER_02]: because her likability was indeed threatening to the other three remaining.

[01:18:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Not as threatening as T-Cor or Kimo, which is the main reason she was there the longest, but still a worry.

[01:18:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Could she have beaten Chelsea?

[01:18:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Doubtful, but it probably wouldn't have been unanimous.

[01:18:43] [SPEAKER_02]: Could she have beaten McKenzie?

[01:18:45] [SPEAKER_02]: Quite possibly if she could have put together some sort of coherent narrative about what she did in the game.

[01:18:52] [SPEAKER_02]: Plus, of course, Chelsea had been in McKenzie's ear about Rubina being more likely to take her out in final three,

[01:18:59] [SPEAKER_02]: when in fact it was Chelsea who was more worried that Rubina would take herself or Kim out.

[01:19:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, no, I mean, that was her threatening level where we could –

[01:19:10] [SPEAKER_02]: I guess let me correct myself before someone corrects me in the comment.

[01:19:13] [SPEAKER_02]: If Rubina had stayed, Kim would have already been taken out.

[01:19:16] [SPEAKER_02]: So, it would have been herself, yeah.

[01:19:19] [SPEAKER_03]: But if we go down the votes and figure things out, if you think about it, I mean, most likely –

[01:19:24] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I think we have Kimo will vote for her no matter what she did.

[01:19:27] [SPEAKER_03]: I think to be cool, would have voted for her?

[01:19:29] [SPEAKER_03]: She still could have – might have felt like, oh, maybe I'd give Chelsea the win just because of how her power –

[01:19:34] [SPEAKER_03]: how overall she was really well played.

[01:19:36] [SPEAKER_03]: And if Rubina wins that final HOH, I think that changes something to some people's mind.

[01:19:41] [SPEAKER_03]: I can see Angela staying bitter against Chelsea because she wants to give the vote to Rubina in a way.

[01:19:45] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, there's an argument to me made there.

[01:19:48] [SPEAKER_03]: And with Mackenzie, I would say it's almost a 50-50 at that point.

[01:19:52] [SPEAKER_03]: So, I can really see Rubina taking that one back home.

[01:19:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, that was what was – we talked about like having that trio in there was such a mistake for all the players

[01:20:01] [SPEAKER_03]: that this is – they had to get them out one by one by one potentially.

[01:20:06] [SPEAKER_03]: And Mackenzie's case, this was a great opportunity for her to finally win it because now, you know,

[01:20:12] [SPEAKER_03]: maybe Chelsea doesn't want to get out her versus – you know, they really need to get Cam out last one

[01:20:17] [SPEAKER_03]: because that puts Mackenzie in a great position where she's kind of insulated.

[01:20:20] [SPEAKER_02]: Right, right.

[01:20:22] [SPEAKER_02]: Which is exactly why Chelsea was, you know, wormed into Mackenzie's brain saying,

[01:20:27] [SPEAKER_02]: no, you got to get rid of Rubina.

[01:20:30] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, moving back to Chelsea, by all rights, she should have been recognized as the biggest threat.

[01:20:36] [SPEAKER_02]: She even said it herself.

[01:20:38] [SPEAKER_02]: I quoted her talking about that to Mike Bloom earlier.

[01:20:40] [SPEAKER_02]: And a few people did see it.

[01:20:42] [SPEAKER_02]: I quoted one of Joseph's interviews back in Rule 1 identifying her as playing the best game.

[01:20:46] [SPEAKER_02]: And he had the same opinion while in the house too.

[01:20:49] [SPEAKER_02]: Way back at the end of July, he said Chelsea is smart and the biggest threat in this game by far.

[01:20:55] [SPEAKER_02]: Later, Quinn would say Chelsea was by far the most well-positioned player in the game.

[01:21:00] [SPEAKER_02]: But even they weren't the only ones to see it.

[01:21:04] [SPEAKER_02]: During, I think, Janky World, Leah told Mackenzie that if either of them were up against Chelsea, they were screwed.

[01:21:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Mackenzie claimed to agree but felt that targeting a so-called floater,

[01:21:17] [SPEAKER_02]: who actually wasn't a floater, just someone on the other side,

[01:21:21] [SPEAKER_02]: but targeting one of them was more important.

[01:21:23] [SPEAKER_02]: And then, as the end of the game approached, she was talking to Rubina,

[01:21:28] [SPEAKER_02]: who brought up what would happen if it was Mackenzie and Chelsea at the end.

[01:21:33] [SPEAKER_02]: And Mackenzie was clearly right when she said Chelsea would win.

[01:21:36] [SPEAKER_02]: And plus, that Cam would take Chelsea to the end.

[01:21:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Yet, Mackenzie steadfastly ignored this reality,

[01:21:43] [SPEAKER_02]: which, again, goes to show how good a job Chelsea did in protecting herself and getting into her brain.

[01:21:51] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, first, she did a good job of hiding her threat level,

[01:21:56] [SPEAKER_02]: even if some people noticed it.

[01:21:58] [SPEAKER_02]: But then she got herself to a place where it didn't even matter.

[01:22:02] [SPEAKER_02]: She could have been walking around with a sign that said,

[01:22:04] [SPEAKER_02]: biggest threat on it.

[01:22:06] [SPEAKER_02]: And Mackenzie would have been like, ha-ha, that's a funny shirt.

[01:22:10] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, no, I mean, we see a pattern right here.

[01:22:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Anybody who saw Chelsea at the threat, Chelsea clocked that and was like, we need to get you out.

[01:22:19] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, Sister Matthew, she didn't allow an alliance of people to come against her

[01:22:24] [SPEAKER_03]: because she was able to get each, you know, she's pegging.

[01:22:27] [SPEAKER_03]: It was like one of those games where you hammer down arcade games, hit them all down.

[01:22:32] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's what she did.

[01:22:34] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you know, when you're running from a bear, they always say,

[01:22:37] [SPEAKER_03]: you don't need to outrun the bear.

[01:22:38] [SPEAKER_03]: You just need to outrun the other person next to you.

[01:22:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's what she basically did.

[01:22:42] [SPEAKER_03]: And Mackenzie, in this scenario, really just wasn't trying to get after her.

[01:22:47] [SPEAKER_03]: She just wanted to grab anybody else, you know?

[01:22:50] [SPEAKER_03]: And she played that.

[01:22:51] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's the thing is that's a combination of when you use all three of your social,

[01:22:56] [SPEAKER_03]: your competition, your strategic, like wellness all together,

[01:22:59] [SPEAKER_03]: you're able to mitigate these issues of being such a huge threat because you have insulated yourself.

[01:23:04] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, again, that's why I think this game was really cool to see and blossom itself in the end game.

[01:23:10] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I think a lot of players were watching like, oh, this is going to be kind of a boring end game with Chelsea

[01:23:14] [SPEAKER_03]: or these other players because they haven't done this and that.

[01:23:17] [SPEAKER_03]: No, we saw all her setup come all together and we're like, whoa, these last two weeks were like,

[01:23:23] [SPEAKER_03]: all her work has come together to show this beautiful win.

[01:23:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, like all those people who claimed, oh, Tucker's gone.

[01:23:30] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm done watching it.

[01:23:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, Angela's gone.

[01:23:33] [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be boring.

[01:23:34] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, if any of those people actually did start, you know, stop watching, then they missed a good game.

[01:23:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Of course, if all you were watching for was Tucker's antics, well, then fine, whatever, you know.

[01:23:45] [SPEAKER_02]: But.

[01:23:46] [SPEAKER_02]: They voted.

[01:23:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[01:23:48] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, that is true.

[01:23:56] [SPEAKER_02]: Because many people would have been worried to move forward with someone who won as many comps as McKenzie had.

[01:24:02] [SPEAKER_02]: But as Chelsea told Mike Bloom, I decided let me keep her around because as long as she's here, she will be a bigger target than me.

[01:24:10] [SPEAKER_02]: And as long as I develop a deep relationship with her, she will also take me.

[01:24:15] [SPEAKER_02]: And she was obviously right on both counts.

[01:24:17] [SPEAKER_02]: The funny thing is that while she was doing that, Kimo and Rubina were talking to each other about what a huge threat McKenzie was and how she had to go.

[01:24:27] [SPEAKER_02]: And certainly Chelsea saw that because no way Chelsea could go to the end with her.

[01:24:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Once again, we see that Chelsea had a much better understanding of the game than those two.

[01:24:38] [SPEAKER_03]: For me, it's almost impressive.

[01:24:41] [SPEAKER_03]: I think McKenzie changed the game slightly with her final decision and stuff like that.

[01:24:45] [SPEAKER_03]: No longer can we just refer to players that have these win ceilings and these huge targets as a shield.

[01:24:53] [SPEAKER_03]: But in this case, a sword, because McKenzie was never a shield for.

[01:24:58] [SPEAKER_03]: Come on.

[01:24:58] [SPEAKER_02]: There's only one sword instead of a shield.

[01:25:01] [SPEAKER_02]: That's Taylor.

[01:25:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Come on.

[01:25:04] [SPEAKER_03]: She is the sword on her own right.

[01:25:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[01:25:06] [SPEAKER_03]: But the way Chelsea wielded McKenzie, it was a sword because it was never coming back at her.

[01:25:12] [SPEAKER_03]: At the one point, you have to ditch your shield and be like, all right, you need to go.

[01:25:15] [SPEAKER_03]: All right.

[01:25:15] [SPEAKER_03]: She didn't.

[01:25:16] [SPEAKER_03]: She was able to keep her sword all the way through.

[01:25:18] [SPEAKER_03]: And anybody who was thinking of getting Chelsea, McKenzie was like, nah, you're going out first.

[01:25:23] [SPEAKER_03]: I got you.

[01:25:24] [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, it's so tough to see because I think I would have loved, I would have felt better for McKenzie, honestly, if Chelsea at the end cut her.

[01:25:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Because then I would have been like, all right, well, you did what you, if you won that last competition, you could have won and took it out.

[01:25:37] [SPEAKER_03]: But knowing this is the reality of it hurts.

[01:25:39] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:25:41] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:25:41] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, McKenzie herself had a different view of how to handle threats.

[01:25:45] [SPEAKER_02]: She went on about how she was the opposite of Tucker because she wanted to, or he wanted to take out the threats while she wanted to let the threat stay.

[01:25:53] [SPEAKER_02]: So they could all have a good game and be kumbaya.

[01:25:56] [SPEAKER_02]: And she even said she didn't care if that got her ass booted.

[01:26:00] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, even back when she said that I wrote in my notes, well, that makes you a terrible player.

[01:26:07] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, she stuck to that idea.

[01:26:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Here we are.

[01:26:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Yep.

[01:26:14] [SPEAKER_03]: You stick to the idea and that's what happens.

[01:26:16] [SPEAKER_03]: And this is the result right there.

[01:26:17] [SPEAKER_03]: You, I don't, you don't do it.

[01:26:20] [SPEAKER_03]: She was okay with that.

[01:26:21] [SPEAKER_03]: And she says she's okay with that.

[01:26:22] [SPEAKER_03]: So it's, you know, we'll see what time tells.

[01:26:25] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:26:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Her bank account, not mine.

[01:26:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Still 75k richer, but yeah.

[01:26:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:26:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Just not 750k richer.

[01:26:35] [SPEAKER_02]: Um, yeah.

[01:26:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Now as for cam, he looked like a threat a couple of times, uh, first early on, because like you said earlier, looking at him, he appeared to be the kind of guy who could win comps.

[01:26:48] [SPEAKER_02]: Books can be deceiving.

[01:26:49] [SPEAKER_02]: Don't judge a book by its cover.

[01:26:51] [SPEAKER_02]: Um, he, he started to become a social threat as well, but both of those faded and he became in the words of Leah, the least threatening person.

[01:26:59] [SPEAKER_02]: Which I'm sure was fine by him because that was part of his goal that he mentioned earlier.

[01:27:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:27:06] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, he, he wanted to ensure that that was his strategy.

[01:27:09] [SPEAKER_03]: He was worried that he would come off as too much.

[01:27:11] [SPEAKER_03]: I thought the issue was, I think he should have become a more of a threat in the game.

[01:27:14] [SPEAKER_03]: I think that hindered him so much that he kind of played that other way.

[01:27:18] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think you kind of said it, you like anyone he, when, uh, it was the Brooke where if Brooke, the week Brooklyn, uh, if she won the AI competition, he could have been a potential, you know, person to go home.

[01:27:30] [SPEAKER_03]: That worried him.

[01:27:30] [SPEAKER_03]: And he wanted to change his game to play a much more like calm, lay low game.

[01:27:34] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think he did that too much.

[01:27:36] [SPEAKER_03]: At some point, there's a reason why you're a threat, right?

[01:27:38] [SPEAKER_03]: You're a threat because everyone who's going to win the game or should win the game should be a threat.

[01:27:42] [SPEAKER_03]: It's just how you mask it.

[01:27:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[01:27:44] [SPEAKER_03]: The issue was he did not become a threat anymore.

[01:27:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And that means you have no winner.

[01:27:48] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, when your comic strip is your comic book is literally you fading into the, into the background.

[01:27:54] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[01:27:54] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, uh, all right.

[01:27:57] [SPEAKER_02]: We could go to the seventh rule, which says to trust almost nobody.

[01:28:00] [SPEAKER_02]: I feel like in the future, people might look back and wonder how Chelsea could have possibly trusted McKenzie and cam to take her to the end.

[01:28:11] [SPEAKER_02]: But the thing is, she didn't just trust them.

[01:28:14] [SPEAKER_02]: She worked on them until she knew what they would do.

[01:28:19] [SPEAKER_02]: This wasn't a situation where someone just said something in another person believed it.

[01:28:23] [SPEAKER_02]: It was the result of a lot of hard work on Chelsea's part.

[01:28:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:28:30] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you have to work hard to miss people that much.

[01:28:33] [SPEAKER_03]: And I guess maybe we can, I mean, it's a strategy.

[01:28:35] [SPEAKER_03]: It's social, but maybe this is a part where we can say it is the mist of how you make people trust you, but you don't trust them so much.

[01:28:43] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I don't feel like Chelsea ever put her game life in anybody else's hand.

[01:28:47] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that's the most we can ask for in this type of role where you don't let yourself be threatened or put yourself in a form of risk really because you trusted somebody too much.

[01:28:58] [SPEAKER_03]: And we didn't really see that too much from her.

[01:29:00] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, of course, there was that one week where they got duped a little bit with the Cedric stuff like that, but she was able to kind of maneuver her way there.

[01:29:07] [SPEAKER_03]: And the good thing is she didn't trust Cedric so much that he was able to throw her under the bus in a way.

[01:29:12] [SPEAKER_03]: So, I mean, overall, I really can't see, you know, she really let people connect on her with a personal level.

[01:29:19] [SPEAKER_03]: But game wise, she gave them as much information as they needed without divulging too much.

[01:29:24] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. Now, as a counterexample, you know, I just mentioned one person saying something and the other just believing it.

[01:29:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, we can look at Mackenzie.

[01:29:33] [SPEAKER_02]: As I mentioned earlier, we saw her admitting to her own naivete more than once.

[01:29:39] [SPEAKER_02]: And yet she still somehow insisted at the end that nobody could influence her and she made decisions for herself.

[01:29:49] [SPEAKER_02]: But that's what Chelsea and to an extent Cam did.

[01:29:53] [SPEAKER_02]: They completely influenced her.

[01:29:56] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, like I said, Chelsea was in her brain.

[01:29:59] [SPEAKER_02]: The fact that she didn't recognize it made it even that much better.

[01:30:03] [SPEAKER_02]: Like you have been brainwashed and you do not even realize that the brainwasher is sitting right next to you.

[01:30:11] [SPEAKER_03]: That's the hardest thing about the show, I think, after the fact for the cast members is that looking back and realizing, wow, like,

[01:30:18] [SPEAKER_03]: because you feel the reason why you make decisions in a game is because you have this relationship with this player,

[01:30:22] [SPEAKER_03]: especially in her case that she wants to bring forward.

[01:30:24] [SPEAKER_03]: She's trusting him.

[01:30:25] [SPEAKER_03]: And now you have to basically look back and say, man, the last 90 days, like a lot of our relationship is built on certain forms of lies, this and that.

[01:30:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Like your goal was basically to manipulate me to get this window.

[01:30:36] [SPEAKER_03]: Again, nothing wrong with that.

[01:30:37] [SPEAKER_03]: That's part of the game.

[01:30:38] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[01:30:38] [SPEAKER_03]: But for the player on the other end, that's a really difficult pill this fall.

[01:30:42] [SPEAKER_03]: So, you know, we can beat on a horse, you know, a dying horse.

[01:30:46] [SPEAKER_03]: But like at this point, we know what she did basically kind of ruined the game for her.

[01:30:51] [SPEAKER_03]: I just only hope that she can kind of at least realize like, OK, this wasn't the best decision for me game wise,

[01:30:58] [SPEAKER_03]: but also be able to accept the reality of it and then move on from it and take whatever positive she can.

[01:31:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I just wouldn't want to be in her shoes right now, especially after everyone basically probably imagined the whole Internet telling her like, what did you do?

[01:31:11] [SPEAKER_02]: I hope she stays away from the Internet.

[01:31:13] [SPEAKER_02]: Quite honestly, I hope she stays away from the Internet, stays away from this podcast, stays away from all podcasts.

[01:31:17] [SPEAKER_02]: You like.

[01:31:18] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:31:19] [SPEAKER_02]: You'll need some time to absorb what happened.

[01:31:21] [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.

[01:31:22] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:31:23] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, but saying that we still, you know, our job is to be honest.

[01:31:28] [SPEAKER_02]: And so, you know, but all right, we can go to Appendix A, which is about the jury phase of the game.

[01:31:34] [SPEAKER_02]: And I think today we'll just focus on the final two here, starting with how they handle Q&A and their final speech.

[01:31:41] [SPEAKER_02]: Speaking of being brutally honest, we had heard through much of the season that Chelsea was a master speaker.

[01:31:49] [SPEAKER_02]: And she certainly showed it.

[01:31:52] [SPEAKER_02]: And I just want to read back some of what she said in her best response, which was to Cam's question.

[01:31:59] [SPEAKER_02]: She said, I did not have to survive the block.

[01:32:02] [SPEAKER_02]: I did not have to win competitions to get here.

[01:32:05] [SPEAKER_02]: My social game was strong enough to get me to the end.

[01:32:08] [SPEAKER_02]: Could I have won?

[01:32:09] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[01:32:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I proved that in the endurance comp when I beat two D1 athletes.

[01:32:13] [SPEAKER_02]: If you look at my game, it is not one sided.

[01:32:16] [SPEAKER_02]: It's a diamond.

[01:32:16] [SPEAKER_02]: If you look at it from multiple perspectives, you can see that it is beautiful.

[01:32:23] [SPEAKER_02]: This and then follow up in her final words drove home all the important points about her game.

[01:32:30] [SPEAKER_02]: If anyone was still on the fence, this pushed them fully onto her side.

[01:32:36] [SPEAKER_02]: She had been going through it for days, all while telling McKenzie, oh, I have no idea what I'm going to say.

[01:32:42] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, I'm just going to wing it and you should too.

[01:32:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, no, I mean, it was it was a beautifully crafted final speech she did there.

[01:32:51] [SPEAKER_03]: Her answer was good.

[01:32:52] [SPEAKER_03]: I was a little worried.

[01:32:52] [SPEAKER_03]: I'll be honest, though, in the beginning initial portion when she had answered Angela's question first, I thought she didn't.

[01:32:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Because typically when you answer one of your jury members questions or in any form of these types of shows, you want to give a little back to them.

[01:33:07] [SPEAKER_03]: You want to make them feel validated for the question or ask you on any of their feelings board.

[01:33:10] [SPEAKER_03]: I didn't think she really did that with Angela initially where she was like, if you're sad, you can be sad.

[01:33:16] [SPEAKER_03]: She didn't say it like that, but she stuck by her gun.

[01:33:17] [SPEAKER_03]: She like didn't back down, which, again, I appreciate that.

[01:33:21] [SPEAKER_03]: But I also was worried that it might cost her the vote there.

[01:33:24] [SPEAKER_03]: But then she continually she stayed on that.

[01:33:26] [SPEAKER_03]: She basically reiterated that like this is my game.

[01:33:29] [SPEAKER_03]: I believe the way I played it was great and the best game between us two.

[01:33:34] [SPEAKER_03]: And I deserve to win because of that.

[01:33:36] [SPEAKER_03]: And you should understand.

[01:33:37] [SPEAKER_03]: And that was kind of what she reinforced.

[01:33:38] [SPEAKER_03]: I actually really love that.

[01:33:40] [SPEAKER_03]: I love people standing behind our games.

[01:33:42] [SPEAKER_03]: And overall, it was a great performance against anybody.

[01:33:45] [SPEAKER_03]: But I also think it was helped probably in due because of the polar opposite answers we got from McKenzie.

[01:33:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:33:53] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, McKenzie basically did wing it.

[01:33:56] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, she said the words that Chelsea had told her that her game spoke for itself.

[01:34:03] [SPEAKER_02]: And it did.

[01:34:04] [SPEAKER_02]: Just not in the way she thought.

[01:34:06] [SPEAKER_02]: It spoke for herself because all she had was comps.

[01:34:10] [SPEAKER_02]: And even when she won those comps, she wasn't the one actually making decisions.

[01:34:15] [SPEAKER_02]: And the jurors figured it out.

[01:34:18] [SPEAKER_02]: Even before hearing it from Chelsea's mouth, they discussed at the roundtable how they thought Chelsea was doing well exactly what she was doing.

[01:34:25] [SPEAKER_02]: And they just wanted confirmation, which they got.

[01:34:30] [SPEAKER_02]: And they also got confirmation that McKenzie was the puppet.

[01:34:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it was tough because I don't know if it was one of those things where it was like it felt like the defense was already set up by that.

[01:34:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Like the prosecution right there.

[01:34:42] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, when she answered her one move, she really made strategic.

[01:34:46] [SPEAKER_03]: It was the Leah move.

[01:34:47] [SPEAKER_03]: And then right after it, completely discounted by Chelsea.

[01:34:50] [SPEAKER_03]: Like she hook, line and sinker.

[01:34:52] [SPEAKER_03]: I think I watched over again earlier today.

[01:34:56] [SPEAKER_03]: I saw McKenzie's face.

[01:34:57] [SPEAKER_03]: It's kind of drop when she realized basically like my one answer was actually now just influenced or was being told to be influenced by Chelsea.

[01:35:06] [SPEAKER_03]: And keep in mind, you can't fact check on here and everything like that.

[01:35:09] [SPEAKER_03]: You don't know.

[01:35:10] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, it was the truth.

[01:35:12] [SPEAKER_03]: But Chelsea was able to craft it regardless of one or the other being like, hey, this is my like, this is my plan.

[01:35:17] [SPEAKER_03]: You she just sold you what she thought was her plan.

[01:35:20] [SPEAKER_03]: That was actually my plan.

[01:35:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Did not help at all.

[01:35:23] [SPEAKER_02]: No, no.

[01:35:24] [SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, that was just.

[01:35:28] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, it was it was.

[01:35:32] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't even know how to describe it.

[01:35:34] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I made that obviously one of my my tick tocks on that.

[01:35:38] [SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, it was it was just so perfectly set up, you know, that McKenzie just fell right into that trap to use that as her.

[01:35:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Best example.

[01:35:48] [SPEAKER_02]: Like, why would you do that?

[01:35:52] [SPEAKER_02]: But, you know, as dealing as far as dealing with the jury overall, it seems both of them had some misreads.

[01:35:59] [SPEAKER_02]: The difference was for Chelsea.

[01:36:01] [SPEAKER_02]: They were misreads in a positive direction.

[01:36:03] [SPEAKER_02]: Like she thought Quinn would vote for the person who had the most comp wins, as she said in interviews.

[01:36:09] [SPEAKER_02]: And that blew my mind because he of all people was going to vote for the person who played the best game of Big Brother.

[01:36:19] [SPEAKER_02]: So that was a pretty bad misread, especially since Quinn had told her while he was in the game that if she that if he got sniped, he would lift up the game in the jury.

[01:36:31] [SPEAKER_02]: And he did.

[01:36:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:36:33] [SPEAKER_02]: But, you know, it was somewhat understandable that she might think Leah and Angela would vote for McKenzie to win.

[01:36:39] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, and I have to say Angela's vote for Chelsea surprised me the most, especially after we saw her antics in the roundtable, which, by the way, Taylor did a great job of shutting her down.

[01:36:53] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, but then we also saw Angela making some faces while Chelsea was talking in the final two.

[01:37:00] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, someone commented about her vote on one of my TikToks.

[01:37:03] [SPEAKER_02]: And usually when I say, oh, I got this comment on a TikTok, it's it's some ridiculous thing.

[01:37:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just making fun of it.

[01:37:10] [SPEAKER_02]: But this one actually raised an interesting point.

[01:37:13] [SPEAKER_02]: Could Angela have been pissed off when she found out McKenzie didn't want to veto her and didn't even like her?

[01:37:22] [SPEAKER_02]: But Chelsea was the one who convinced her to do it.

[01:37:26] [SPEAKER_02]: So this was a point against McKenzie and a point for Chelsea at the same time.

[01:37:33] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, so emotionally speaking, I think that could have gotten Angela to be like, well, why would I want to vote for McKenzie now?

[01:37:41] [SPEAKER_02]: And plus, we know how much Angela complained about being on the wrong side of a vote when she was in the game.

[01:37:47] [SPEAKER_02]: So maybe she realized which way it was going and didn't want to be on the wrong side here either.

[01:37:51] [SPEAKER_02]: She didn't want to be doing interviews and explaining on social media why she voted, you know, the way that the majority did.

[01:37:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think, you know, it's one of those things that McKenzie might have had a chance, probably not actually, but she would have had a fighting chance if she was able to craft some really good answers here and talk about why she does deserve to win.

[01:38:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Here's the thing is like saying my game speaks for itself.

[01:38:14] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, but now you have to speak for it.

[01:38:16] [SPEAKER_03]: You need to advocate for your game that why does there are love?

[01:38:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Because here's the thing is, yes, we have kind of drilled into McKenzie in so many different forms of it.

[01:38:24] [SPEAKER_03]: But I don't want to like it that she had no she she had incredible competition wins.

[01:38:28] [SPEAKER_03]: She was placed in good positions that she was able to maneuver, whether we say it was because of Chelsea.

[01:38:33] [SPEAKER_03]: That's what we're saying here.

[01:38:34] [SPEAKER_03]: But in those moments, she has her argument she can give to this jury.

[01:38:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And she was she was able to craft it here.

[01:38:42] [SPEAKER_03]: When you fumble Angela, when you've given her veto of veto, saved her butt here.

[01:38:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Leah, yes, you voted her out, but you could have made some made it such a huge threat.

[01:38:51] [SPEAKER_03]: I need to do this. Leah, I love you.

[01:38:52] [SPEAKER_03]: I want to know there.

[01:38:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe you can kind of bring Quinn on the side from there because of that connection there.

[01:38:57] [SPEAKER_03]: I still feel like there was something there.

[01:38:59] [SPEAKER_03]: There's a way to maneuver yourself into this.

[01:39:01] [SPEAKER_03]: And she just didn't give herself a shot.

[01:39:03] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, she was completely outclassed at every point of it.

[01:39:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think we said end game.

[01:39:07] [SPEAKER_03]: She had no idea what she was walking in herself into when she went into these jury questions.

[01:39:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.

[01:39:13] [SPEAKER_02]: Because she got all her advice from her opponent.

[01:39:15] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, we talked about that earlier.

[01:39:17] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I mean, we we saw and heard McKenzie.

[01:39:21] [SPEAKER_02]: And she told Mike Blue she was not afraid to sit next to the best people and go head to head.

[01:39:25] [SPEAKER_02]: And again, her game plan was not to get out huge competitors, but rather, quote, my game plan was to play Big Brother.

[01:39:32] [SPEAKER_02]: And that's exactly what I did.

[01:39:35] [SPEAKER_02]: No, you didn't.

[01:39:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Or if you did, it was poorly because she has no idea of what it actually means to play Big Brother.

[01:39:42] [SPEAKER_02]: She played Big Brother reindeer games.

[01:39:45] [SPEAKER_02]: She played comps, you know, and she thought that's what it was to play Big Brother.

[01:39:52] [SPEAKER_02]: But it's not, especially when you get to the end game.

[01:39:55] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, she she further told Mike Bloom she knew her chances to win would have been much better against Cam.

[01:40:02] [SPEAKER_02]: And she even said she carried him along because she knew she could beat him in the end.

[01:40:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:40:06] [SPEAKER_02]: When she got to the end, she didn't do it.

[01:40:09] [SPEAKER_02]: She added to Mike.

[01:40:10] [SPEAKER_02]: But again, my game plan wasn't to have an easy win.

[01:40:13] [SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't to play a game that I didn't want.

[01:40:16] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:40:17] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, winning three quarters of a million dollars was clearly not a game anyone would want to play.

[01:40:22] [SPEAKER_02]: Who would want that?

[01:40:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's tough, especially when she says that, because if that's her strategy carried, she didn't carry him over to win.

[01:40:30] [SPEAKER_03]: She carried Cam basically to give another vote to Chelsea.

[01:40:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[01:40:34] [SPEAKER_03]: You put that.

[01:40:35] [SPEAKER_03]: She she made it so that she would have all the blood on her hand and at the end still cut him.

[01:40:40] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, that's what's frustrating to me that she had.

[01:40:43] [SPEAKER_03]: She she had these incredible wins and abilities to enact change.

[01:40:47] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, she could enact and change in the Big Brother house to make sure that she when she was in these positions here, even if she doesn't know the game, having these wins right here.

[01:40:56] [SPEAKER_03]: And the way she could be like, all right, you know, at this point, it doesn't take a sign to say two plus two is four.

[01:41:02] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, I need to do this.

[01:41:04] [SPEAKER_03]: I need to take Cam out here.

[01:41:05] [SPEAKER_03]: I need to take out Chelsea.

[01:41:06] [SPEAKER_03]: This is my moves right here.

[01:41:07] [SPEAKER_03]: And this is what I did.

[01:41:07] [SPEAKER_03]: And like now put me and him next to each other.

[01:41:10] [SPEAKER_03]: Tell me who should win.

[01:41:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Like, yeah.

[01:41:13] [SPEAKER_03]: So, I mean, overall there, the jury management was completely mishandled.

[01:41:17] [SPEAKER_03]: But I mean, one person understood what jury management meant and one person did not know that existed to be a part of the game.

[01:41:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[01:41:23] [SPEAKER_03]: So, you know, yes, you want to stand next to the best of the best, but you don't understand what you're being judged upon.

[01:41:29] [SPEAKER_03]: That's the issue.

[01:41:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:41:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:41:32] [SPEAKER_02]: That's a very good point.

[01:41:33] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, OK, I want to be judged against the best.

[01:41:35] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, the best what exactly?

[01:41:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:41:37] [SPEAKER_02]: You know.

[01:41:39] [SPEAKER_02]: So.

[01:41:39] [SPEAKER_02]: All right.

[01:41:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I had mentioned that when we were getting to the end of the rules, I was going to talk about our, you know, our regular segment.

[01:41:46] [SPEAKER_02]: And Julie Chen Moonves is wrong about Blanken.

[01:41:48] [SPEAKER_02]: So we'll close out our season with this one because it's appropriate here.

[01:41:51] [SPEAKER_02]: I had, you know, Dalton Ross had asked Julie about McKenzie's decision to take Chelsea instead of Cam.

[01:41:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Just what we were talking about.

[01:42:00] [SPEAKER_02]: And Julie said she seemed prepared to possibly lose the game in order to stay true to who she is as a person and keep her integrity intact.

[01:42:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm proud of her.

[01:42:11] [SPEAKER_02]: Now, of course, after everything we just discussed, this makes me want to scream.

[01:42:15] [SPEAKER_02]: No.

[01:42:17] [SPEAKER_02]: There is literally nothing to be proud of in her decision.

[01:42:21] [SPEAKER_02]: It was horrible.

[01:42:23] [SPEAKER_02]: She gave away a huge chunk of money.

[01:42:27] [SPEAKER_02]: And yet we can.

[01:42:30] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want to say excuse.

[01:42:32] [SPEAKER_02]: We can understand that she did not know the game.

[01:42:35] [SPEAKER_02]: We'll still criticize her for it.

[01:42:37] [SPEAKER_02]: This is the host of all 26 seasons saying it's great for someone to choose to lose.

[01:42:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Chen Bot right there.

[01:42:49] [SPEAKER_03]: That is the AI, you know, that Ainsley has taken over completely.

[01:42:54] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.

[01:42:55] [SPEAKER_03]: I just don't know how you can.

[01:42:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Most of the time they'll let you take this segment on and just let you do your thing on it.

[01:43:00] [SPEAKER_03]: But it is so sad to see the main game host over here just advocate for people not to play the hardest game here.

[01:43:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Like, play as hard as you want.

[01:43:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Get on Big Brother.

[01:43:09] [SPEAKER_03]: That's, you know, I think that's what separates, unfortunately, Big Brother from other shows at points is where I wish we had people advocate for you to play.

[01:43:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Like, we talk about the greats, the Dr. Wills, you know, all those people.

[01:43:19] [SPEAKER_03]: If we want those players, we want the next generation to be on here to play like that.

[01:43:24] [SPEAKER_03]: The show itself needs to advocate for that.

[01:43:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:43:26] [SPEAKER_02]: But no, she's proud of her for losing.

[01:43:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:43:29] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[01:43:31] [SPEAKER_02]: All right.

[01:43:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it is about time to wrap things up.

[01:43:35] [SPEAKER_02]: So, what are your final thoughts about Chelsea, McKenzie, Cam, and Rubina?

[01:43:41] [SPEAKER_03]: What a season.

[01:43:42] [SPEAKER_03]: I really actually thoroughly enjoyed this entire season of Big Brother 26.

[01:43:45] [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't think that's a hot take.

[01:43:47] [SPEAKER_03]: I think this is a wonderful season from start to finish with a lot of different ups and downs here.

[01:43:52] [SPEAKER_03]: But what makes it even great and what I do love about it is our winner, Chelsea.

[01:43:56] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, she played an overall incredible game from her socials, from her strategic to her wins in competition.

[01:44:03] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we saw an overall player win the game this season.

[01:44:06] [SPEAKER_03]: And I love seeing that.

[01:44:08] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think I didn't know who was going to win the season from the middle ground here.

[01:44:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Even at the end, yes, it was hers to lose.

[01:44:14] [SPEAKER_03]: But also the way she got there was kind of impressive of how she maneuvered it here.

[01:44:18] [SPEAKER_03]: From the people who lost there, Cam, again, I think I would love to hang out with Tim.

[01:44:23] [SPEAKER_03]: It would be fun.

[01:44:25] [SPEAKER_03]: In the game context, there wasn't much of a change in there.

[01:44:27] [SPEAKER_03]: Rubina had a really good potential to play this game even further if she kind of got out of that trio or worked her relationships out of that.

[01:44:36] [SPEAKER_03]: And I kind of sent her home.

[01:44:37] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think the biggest loss, what I hurt the most, is seeing McKenzie because I think this was one of the biggest giveaways right there.

[01:44:45] [SPEAKER_03]: This was a fumble at the one yard.

[01:44:47] [SPEAKER_03]: I know this wasn't even a fumble at the yard.

[01:44:49] [SPEAKER_03]: It was inches right there, you know?

[01:44:52] [SPEAKER_03]: She had to just kind of go in there.

[01:44:54] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think we would have a very different episode because we would have to figure out, all right, well, she broke a lot of these rules, but she won this.

[01:45:00] [SPEAKER_03]: So I guess for our sake, I'm very happy that the rules have triumphed here.

[01:45:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Overall, though, really fun to see him play.

[01:45:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Chelsea deserved to win.

[01:45:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Anybody who else says anything else doesn't understand me.

[01:45:11] [SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[01:45:12] [SPEAKER_02]: For our sake and for the future game's sake, because I think future players will watch this.

[01:45:17] [SPEAKER_02]: So, yes, I very much enjoyed the season, too.

[01:45:19] [SPEAKER_02]: I think, you know, anyone listening to us over this time should know that.

[01:45:23] [SPEAKER_02]: The game came down to a battle between the super fan and the non-fan.

[01:45:28] [SPEAKER_02]: The woman with a plan versus the woman without a clue how to even approach a plan.

[01:45:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Didn't even know a plan was needed.

[01:45:34] [SPEAKER_02]: And the jury made the right decision.

[01:45:36] [SPEAKER_02]: I have seen a few people whining on social media that McKenzie was robbed or other such nonsense.

[01:45:43] [SPEAKER_02]: The people writing it need to seriously step back and realize that Chelsea won unanimously.

[01:45:49] [SPEAKER_02]: And there were many, many good reasons for it as we've gone over.

[01:45:54] [SPEAKER_02]: McKenzie talked about playing the game with pure honesty and loyalty and all those great things that have little to no bearing on the game of Big Brother.

[01:46:01] [SPEAKER_02]: I talked in the first rule about Chelsea's camera chat in which she said, this is not church.

[01:46:08] [SPEAKER_02]: This is the game.

[01:46:09] [SPEAKER_02]: So don't come into Big Brother and say you want to keep your morals intact.

[01:46:14] [SPEAKER_02]: This ain't Uno.

[01:46:15] [SPEAKER_02]: This ain't Monopoly.

[01:46:16] [SPEAKER_02]: This ain't Twister.

[01:46:17] [SPEAKER_02]: This is Big Brother.

[01:46:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Play the game.

[01:46:21] [SPEAKER_02]: And obviously we can see how Chelsea did that all the way until the end while McKenzie truly had no idea she was even supposed to do it.

[01:46:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Watching McKenzie try to play took me back to the very early days of reality TV where some people truly just didn't understand how the game was different from real life.

[01:46:42] [SPEAKER_02]: Nowadays, nobody has any excuse for not realizing that.

[01:46:45] [SPEAKER_02]: Any ignorance is their own fault.

[01:46:48] [SPEAKER_02]: And I've said this before.

[01:46:50] [SPEAKER_02]: We can say, well, they weren't a fan.

[01:46:53] [SPEAKER_02]: They were recruited.

[01:46:54] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't care.

[01:46:55] [SPEAKER_02]: Find out.

[01:46:57] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, when I had a job interview back in the day for a position that maybe I wasn't the best student for.

[01:47:04] [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe I didn't know that much about.

[01:47:06] [SPEAKER_02]: I did research to find out more about it.

[01:47:10] [SPEAKER_02]: I didn't just come in and say, well, you should give me the job, even though I don't really know what it's about.

[01:47:16] [SPEAKER_02]: Similarly, no one's going to give someone the win, even though they don't know what Big Brother's about.

[01:47:21] [SPEAKER_02]: Chelsea simply dominated McKenzie and the game itself.

[01:47:24] [SPEAKER_02]: She said the greatest power I had in this game was my words.

[01:47:28] [SPEAKER_02]: And she used that power to her advantage.

[01:47:31] [SPEAKER_02]: She got people to do what she wanted them to do.

[01:47:34] [SPEAKER_02]: She wanted McKenzie in final three with her.

[01:47:36] [SPEAKER_02]: So she planned for it and she made it happen.

[01:47:40] [SPEAKER_02]: It didn't matter that McKenzie won comps because Chelsea was the one who controlled her.

[01:47:44] [SPEAKER_02]: Indeed, this led to the final battle that essentially boiled down to McKenzie saying, I won lots of comps and Chelsea retorting.

[01:47:55] [SPEAKER_02]: I positioned myself so I didn't need to win comps.

[01:47:59] [SPEAKER_02]: And yet I still did.

[01:48:01] [SPEAKER_02]: I should also mention Cam and Rubina here.

[01:48:04] [SPEAKER_02]: But I really think I've said almost everything I can about them.

[01:48:07] [SPEAKER_02]: Neither of them really played the game.

[01:48:09] [SPEAKER_02]: Cam at least said his move to become quieter was done on purpose.

[01:48:13] [SPEAKER_02]: But that doesn't really mean it was a good idea.

[01:48:17] [SPEAKER_02]: Rubina just carried on the tradition of T-Corps and Kimo.

[01:48:19] [SPEAKER_02]: They became extras in this TV show.

[01:48:22] [SPEAKER_02]: Though Cam at least had a chance if he could have actually won a comp or McKenzie had gotten a clue of how to play.

[01:48:30] [SPEAKER_02]: But those had about equal chances of happening.

[01:48:33] [SPEAKER_02]: Almost zero.

[01:48:34] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think a writer could have scripted the ending to the season any better.

[01:48:40] [SPEAKER_02]: With McKenzie claiming she made her own moves and then using the example of Leah.

[01:48:45] [SPEAKER_02]: Leah.

[01:48:47] [SPEAKER_02]: When she most certainly did not make her own move in that situation.

[01:48:52] [SPEAKER_02]: She said earlier in the game that she was, quote, naive to a fault.

[01:48:56] [SPEAKER_02]: But she wanted to come to Big Brother and show she could make her own decisions.

[01:49:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, she made her own decisions.

[01:49:03] [SPEAKER_02]: And they were the wrong ones.

[01:49:05] [SPEAKER_02]: McKenzie told Mike Bloom, for me, her winning was me winning.

[01:49:09] [SPEAKER_02]: But it wasn't.

[01:49:10] [SPEAKER_02]: There is only one winner.

[01:49:12] [SPEAKER_02]: And she earned it by playing by far the best game this season.

[01:49:16] [SPEAKER_02]: And one of probably the top five or so games of any winner in Big Brother.

[01:49:21] [SPEAKER_02]: And that is why Chelsea won and McKenzie, Cam, and Rubina lost.

[01:49:27] [SPEAKER_03]: Well said, David.

[01:49:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Well said.

[01:49:30] [SPEAKER_03]: My power is my words.

[01:49:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Your power.

[01:49:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Gift of gab.

[01:49:33] [SPEAKER_03]: You do have the gift of gab.

[01:49:34] [SPEAKER_03]: And while the season of Big Brother is over, are talking about reality TV and all these different shows are not because we are active on so many different social media platforms.

[01:49:44] [SPEAKER_03]: So please check us out.

[01:49:46] [SPEAKER_03]: We can be found on Twitter for me at TheOBKabian on Instagram at OBKabian on TikTok.

[01:49:52] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm at BasmatiBoy.

[01:49:53] [SPEAKER_03]: But David is truly all over the place.

[01:49:55] [SPEAKER_03]: And with Survivor still being on here, you need to make sure you check him out.

[01:49:58] [SPEAKER_03]: You can find all his various accounts through his link tree at linktree slash David Bloomberg.

[01:50:02] [SPEAKER_03]: And you can find him on Twitter and Blue Sky at David Bloomberg.

[01:50:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And on threads, Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube, and all video platforms, you can find him at David Bloomberg TV.

[01:50:11] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, just today, shortly before we recorded, I got to over 40,000 subscribers on YouTube.

[01:50:19] [SPEAKER_02]: So I have been posting three or even more videos per day at that site, along with TikTok and Instagram.

[01:50:24] [SPEAKER_02]: Of course, they're mostly about Big Brother and Survivor 47.

[01:50:28] [SPEAKER_02]: I still have a few more on Big Brother.

[01:50:30] [SPEAKER_02]: Of course, lots more on Survivor, plus other shows like The Summit and House of Villains and The Anonymous.

[01:50:39] [SPEAKER_02]: Also, I am, of course, continuing to podcast about Survivor as I talk about why Blank Lost each week with Jessica Lewis.

[01:50:47] [SPEAKER_02]: In addition, I'm co-hosting the Trade Hour podcast, coverage of the Traders Canada Season 2.

[01:50:55] [SPEAKER_02]: So, you know, there you can still find me, like you said, in many different places, many different ways.

[01:51:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

[01:51:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And as we wrap up, I want to encourage people to check out our RHAP patron program at robhasawebsite.com slash patron.

[01:51:10] [SPEAKER_03]: Rob has several patron-only podcasts for Big Brother, plus other perks like the Facebook group and Discord.

[01:51:15] [SPEAKER_03]: You can help support shows like ours and everything on the network by becoming a patron at robhasawebsite.com slash patron.

[01:51:21] [SPEAKER_02]: And, yes, make sure you're subscribed to all of the RHAP podcasts by going to our YXLost feed page or directly on the newly rebranded RHAP We Know Reality TV podcast by going to weknowrealitytv.com and selecting your podcast service of choice.

[01:51:38] [SPEAKER_02]: You'll not only find content like us and, you know, Once Big Brother restarts again, you know, things like the daily live feed updates, but, you know, and a more timely situation.

[01:51:49] [SPEAKER_02]: Also, Survivor and many other shows.

[01:51:51] [SPEAKER_02]: You can get all of those by going to weknowrealitytv.com as well.

[01:51:56] [SPEAKER_03]: And finally, for the last time this season, but not for the future, we want to thank Scott St. Pierre, Jessica Sterling, the whole RJP and Reality TV wrap-ups behind the scenes team for all the work they do editing and posting everything else.

[01:52:07] [SPEAKER_03]: We really appreciate everything you do to get our voices from our microphones to your ears.

[01:52:11] [SPEAKER_03]: And, David, thank you so much for being a wonderful co-host.

[01:52:15] [SPEAKER_03]: You've been wonderful this entire thing.

[01:52:17] [SPEAKER_03]: I love our back and forth takes.

[01:52:18] [SPEAKER_03]: We could never do this without you.

[01:52:20] [SPEAKER_03]: And you guys can catch a lot more of David because he's not stopping anytime soon.

[01:52:24] [SPEAKER_03]: And then finally, I got to thank the viewers and listeners here.

[01:52:27] [SPEAKER_03]: This has been a great season, a marathon.

[01:52:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Thanks for checking in with us week in and week out from commentating, from letting us know your hot and cold tastes.

[01:52:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Some of them are super cold and we disagree completely with them.

[01:52:37] [SPEAKER_03]: We appreciate you giving the time to just comment away.

[01:52:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Let us know what you think about this final four, the winner here, your thoughts.

[01:52:44] [SPEAKER_03]: And overall, you know, what did you think about us this entire season?

[01:52:47] [SPEAKER_03]: We'd love to hear about it.

[01:52:48] [SPEAKER_03]: So just let us know.

[01:52:49] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[01:52:50] [SPEAKER_02]: And thank you, of course, Ovi, for another fun season.

[01:52:54] [SPEAKER_02]: It really is great to be able to talk to you each week and, of course, texting back and forth, you know, as things are happening.

[01:53:01] [SPEAKER_02]: I will miss that, you know, as we move on.

[01:53:05] [SPEAKER_02]: But, you know, feel free to text me your survivor takes.

[01:53:08] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, in the meantime, you know, look forward to next season.

[01:53:16] [SPEAKER_02]: And, yeah, you know, it's just been great.

[01:53:19] [SPEAKER_02]: And I appreciate you.

[01:53:21] [SPEAKER_02]: I appreciate the listeners and viewers.

[01:53:25] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, like I said, hopefully we will continue this on, you know, for as long as Big Brother goes.

[01:53:34] [SPEAKER_03]: That's the goal.

[01:53:34] [SPEAKER_03]: That's the goal.

[01:53:35] [SPEAKER_03]: We'll see you all next year then.

[01:53:37] [SPEAKER_02]: That's right.

[01:53:37] [SPEAKER_02]: See everybody soon.

[01:53:39] [SPEAKER_02]: If you're only a Big Brother viewer, maybe not so soon.

[01:53:43] [SPEAKER_02]: But if you're a Big Brother survivor, other shows, you know, I'll be on those as well.

[01:53:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much, everyone.

[01:53:49] [SPEAKER_02]: Bye.

[01:53:49] [SPEAKER_04]: This is why Blank Lost.

[01:53:52] [SPEAKER_04]: And this is why Blank Lost.

[01:53:56] [SPEAKER_04]: This is why Blank Lost.